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Forum date: 07-12-10
JayBird [5:06]: dow futures -46
carr [7:18]: morning amypats winterpark DJ stevbos
kotarah [7:32]: NEW YORK (AP) -- Stocks were set to slide Monday as traders approach earnings season cautiously and book some profits after the best week of trading in a year. Stock futures fell.
The Dow Jones industrial average jumped 5.3 percent last week and broader indexes posted even larger gains, their biggest since last July. The moves come ahead of earnings season, which kicks off with aluminum producer Alcoa Inc. releasing results after the market closes Monday.
nester [7:32]: morning carr kotarah
kotarah [7:33]: Morning CARR Nester
nester [7:33]: LONDON (AP) -- World stock markets mostly rose Monday after robust Chinese trade figures eased worries about the global recovery and investors looked ahead to the upcoming corporate earnings season.
China's customs agency said over the weekend that exports were up 35 percent in June from a year earlier despite concerns Europe's debt crisis could hurt trade. Exports to Europe rose 36 percent.
"Data for June shows China's trade account continuing to defy gravity, with exports strong despite mounting evidence of a faltering global recovery, and imports strong despite expectations of slowing domestic investment growth," Tom Orlik, an analyst in Beijing for Stone & McCarthy Research Associates, said in a research note.
kotarah [7:33]: Looks like another interesting DAY ??
nester [7:33]: Oil prices dropped below $76 a barrel Monday as the dollar strengthened and investors awaited second-quarter company earnings reports for clues about the strength of the U.S. economy.
By early afternoon in Europe, benchmark crude for August delivery was down 46 cents to $75.63 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange. The contract added 65 cents to settle at $76.09 on Friday.
Oil prices rose sharply last week on investor optimism that the U.S. economy, while likely to slow, won't slip into recession later this year.
"The bottom line is that the economic recovery is slowing down sooner than many analysts expected," energy consultant and trader The Schork Group said in a report. "But we will take a slow recovery over no recovery any day of the week."
kotarah [7:34]: Fortress International Group (FIGI) announced that it has closed approximately $44.0 mln in new contracts for the six months ended June 30, 2010, an increase of nearly 300% compared with $15.0 million in new contracts for the comparable period in 2009
nester [7:35]: NEW ORLEANS (AP) -- BP underwater robots steadily assembled heavy metal pieces in what could be the most significant progress yet toward containing the gushing Gulf of Mexico oil well, watched warily by residents onshore.
The oil giant was ahead of schedule as it went into the 83rd day of the environmental and economic disaster Monday. Across the Gulf region, repeated failures to fix the disaster have taken their toll, breeding skepticism among fishermen and politicians alike.
"At this point, there have been so many ups and downs, disappointments, that everybody down here is like, 'We'll believe it when we see it,'" said Keith Kennedy, a charter boat captain in Venice, La.
nester [7:35]: NEW YORK (AP) -- The credit scores of millions more Americans are sinking to new lows.
Figures provided by FICO Inc. show that 25.5 percent of consumers -- nearly 43.4 million people -- now have a credit score of 599 or below, marking them as poor risks for lenders. It's unlikely they will be able to get credit cards, auto loans or mortgages under the tighter lending standards banks now use.
Because consumers relied so heavily on debt to fuel their spending in recent years, their restricted access to credit is one reason for the slow economic recovery.
"I don't get paid for loan applications, I get paid for closings," said Ritch Workman, a Melbourne, Fla., mortgage broker. "I have plenty of business, but I'm struggling to stay open."
nester [7:36]: WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Federal Reserve's list of worries may be getting longer.
A fading recovery, persistently high unemployment, Europe's debt troubles and commercial real estate losses have garnered most of the attention. But some Fed officials have begun talking more about another trouble zone -- recession-hit U.S. state and local government finances.
The problem is that they have to balance their budgets, unlike the federal government, which is running a deficit equal to more than 10 percent of total economic output.
"They have no choice but to cut spending or raise taxes -- or they get some more help from Washington," said Harm Bandholz, an economist with Unicredit in New York.
He thinks state and local government finances represent the most important domestic risk factor in the U.S. economy. Yet they received only two brief mentions in 19 pages of minutes from the Fed's April policy-setting meeting.
nester [7:37]: WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- Among the companies whose shares are expected to see active trading in Monday's session as earnings season kicks off are Alcoa Inc., CSX Corp. and Novellus Systems Inc.
nester [7:38]: emini futures have fallen from yesterday was just under -700 now -956 looking like a "down" day
nester [7:40]: the economic calendar is filled with events this coming week http://biz.yahoo.com/calendar/
picker304 [7:46]: Good morning all
kotarah [7:46]: goood morning pick
kotarah [7:46]: down down down
picker304 [7:47]: I see Futures are burning up I'm goning ahead and eating my crow early on CSCO lol
kotarah [7:47]: let me know how it tates
nester [7:47]: morning pick
picker304 [7:47]: LOL kot and morning my friend
kotarah [7:48]: I thought your looking for market drop??
picker304 [7:48]: On F yes but it'd have to drop real far so rather have my winner in bag. Ol F put will expire worthless
picker304 [7:49]: Morning nester
kotarah [7:49]: Thats bad
kotarah [7:49]: hes a sleep
picker304 [7:50]: Can't stay long just wanted to eat the crow and say morning to all my friends Speaking of sheep. Lets take care of them today
kotarah [7:51]: Rodger that I like lamb
kotarah [7:51]: BP shares higher in pre-market trade, helped by takeover rumors (34.05)
kotarah [7:55]: Protalix BioTherapeutics (PLX) announced that its New Drug Application for taliglucerase alfa has been accepted for review by the FDA. FDA granted taliglucerase alfa a standard review time of ten months, assigning a PDUFA action date of February 25, 2011... R. R. Donnelley & Sons (RRD) announced that it has been awarded an agreement to produce the Harvard Business Review.
carr [8:00]: Morning Picker Kotarah
kotarah [8:00]: mornig CARR
kotarah [8:02]: Alexza Pharma: AZ-007 (Staccato Zaleplon) selected as next active product candidate (2.85)
kotarah [8:02]: S&P futures vs fair value: -5.50. Nasdaq futures vs fair value: -7.00.
rw [8:06]: GOD bless the sheep Brothr Picker304...Have a good day.
kotarah [8:06]: Early Watchers JASO.. ALXA.. VVUS
nester [8:08]: energy stocks are falling ERX down 1.8% so far
kotarah [8:12]: SOMX early VOLUME NESTER
kotarah [8:13]: World equity markets started the week mixed, and U.S. stock futures are pointing to a modestly lower start (S&P futures -6, DJ futures -45). The weaker start follows a very strong week -- the S&P 500 rose 5.4% last week -- and precedes the unofficial start to earnings season, as Alcoa (AA) reports results after the close today. There has also been some positive corporate news this morning. A major piece of M&A news was announced this morning, with insurer Aon (AON) acquiring human resources outsourcing co Hewitt (HEW) for $4.9 bln, representing a 40% premium to Friday's closing price. In other news, shares of BP are trading higher by 3.2% this morning on a few developments. Most importantly, the co is making progress on a new system to contain the oil flow, saying installation of a new sealing cap assembly is proceeding as planned. There are also news reports stating that the co could face a hostile takeover from competitor Exxon Mobil (XOM). Takeover speculation on BP gained steam as shares plummeted in value. There are also separate reports out indicating that BP is in talks with Apache (APA) to sell assets
nester [8:13]: YEAH... finally. 3.09
kotarah [8:13]: I dont know whats moving it?/
kotarah [8:14]: good call on holding it
nester [8:14]: dont' know either. if is a goofy stock
kotarah [8:15]: Something is pushing it
nester [8:15]: not showing anything
jim [8:15]: Good morning everyone hope you all had a nice weekend
nester [8:16]: morning jim
kotarah [8:16]: I looked every where
carr [8:16]: morning jim
jim [8:16]: Morning Nester
kotarah [8:16]: good morning JIM
jim [8:16]: no news on SOMX?
kotarah [8:16]: no
jim [8:16]: Mornig kotarah
nester [8:16]: no news... just moving nicely
kotarah [8:17]: yes
kotarah [8:17]: maybe announcing something?
nester [8:17]: this ticker still scares me though. runs up in the morning only to fall the entire day
jim [8:17]: I put a sell in at 3.14 has not gone off yet
kotarah [8:17]: JASO on fire
nester [8:18]: i'm going to hold until 3.50
jim [8:18]: good luck with that one
kotarah [8:18]: youlll get your sell now I think thats an excellent idea if it pulls back then sell
nester [8:19]: only got 3k shares.
nester [8:19]: may add around 3.20ish
jim [8:19]: I picked up 5k friday
kotarah [8:19]: 10 you need a hand
jim [8:19]: looks like 3.05 may be the real number
kotarah [8:20]: higher
kotarah [8:20]: starts out with Volume today encouraging sing
nester [8:21]: yes, this premarket on it is good news. it normally doesn't have that much action
kotarah [8:22]: Nester what did the Mexican Fire Chief call his two sons ??
nester [8:22]: what?
kotarah [8:22]: HOSE A.. HOSE..B
nester [8:22]: lol
nester [8:23]: today is another heavy meeting day for me. i'll be in and out most of the day
kotarah [8:24]: I will be doing the same
jim [8:24]: you guys should just give me all your money and i will take care of it for you
kotarah [8:25]: Sure you will JIM I'll get right on it
kotarah [8:27]: Somx This was my entry point $3.06
jim [8:27]: out SOMX 3.07 +2%
nester [8:29]: no prob jim... i've been trying to give the keys away for my trading account...
carr [8:29]: jim will you take mine on too
jim [8:30]: sure just send it all my way
nester [8:30]: when we are moving north constantly, you can have them. on down days, i do very well
kotarah [8:30]: JIM dont believe him You couldnt get those keys with a crow bar
nester [8:31]: hey hey...
kotarah [8:31]: SOMX retreating
jim [8:32]: have a buy in at 2.98 SOMX
carr [8:32]: Tuesday Morning sees Q4 EPS above Street, sales beat 07/12 08:30 AM
kotarah [8:32]: ON AA
jim [8:33]: looks like TUES may be a watcher today
nester [8:33]: banks aren't moving like i expected them to
kotarah [8:34]: C is up slightly
nester [8:34]: GS is down
kotarah [8:34]: AAPL is down 0.80
jim [8:34]: BP is on the move up over 3%
kotarah [8:35]: News of buy out take over
nester [8:35]: they announced they may sell a few assets also
carr [8:35]: 08:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 07/12/2010 (MidnightTrader) -- Health care issues are mixed before the bell, while Russia became the first country to approve a multiple sclerosis pill developed by Germany's Merck (MRCG). Sernova (SEOVF:$0.1310,$0.0000,0.00%) said its device to control diabetes has proved to be effective in pre-clinical trials on pigs that were made diabetic. The glucose control device is implanted under the skin to achieve long-term glucose normalization.
http://www.midnighttrader.com
carr [8:36]: 08:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 07/12/2010 (MidnightTrader) -- Financial issues are mixed before the bell, while insurance broker Aon (AON) will buy Hewitt Associates (HEW:$35.40,00$0.00,000.00%) for $4.9 billion in cash and stock to expand its division advising companies on employee pay and benefits. Blackstone Group will manage a real estate fund in Asia for Bank of America-Merrill Lynch (BOA) worth about $2 billion, according to media reports.
http://www.midnighttrader.com
kotarah [8:36]: Looks like BIOD Only it doesnt go under skin
kotarah [8:37]: S&P futures vs fair value: -4.70. Nasdaq futures vs fair value: -4.50.
kotarah [8:37]: Watch ..BIOD
madriver [8:40]: jim.....see bp going to sell off some assets supposedly....that can't be good for their bottomline longterm
carr [8:41]: morning madriver
jim [8:42]: agree MAD they are also having trouble in the board room between the ceo and chairman
nester [8:42]: but is does up their "cash assets"
jim [8:43]: yes but
jim [8:44]: morning Carr, Mad
carr [8:45]: hey Jim
LEECO [8:46]: Morning (I din't say good for me the company that now owns my old company and is obligated to pay my retirement pay and who stopped doing so in April and who I filed a suit for just gave me a notice that they applied for Chapt 11 BK. other than that I'm fine-so morning
carr [8:47]: Sorry to hear that LEECO
jim [8:47]: wow Leeco very sorry to hear that
nester [8:48]: sorry Leeco
madriver [8:48]: that stinks leeco
madriver [8:49]: aren't they obligated to pay ......goes to the PBGC?
LEECO [8:49]: So morning jim, Carr, Macd,nester,kotarah,picker,JB-so looks like i"ll HAVE TO make $trading to take up the slack LOL
kotarah [8:49]: Technologies (UQM) announced that it has received an initial order for over fifty PowerPhase electric propulsion systems as part of the fleet build and vehicle development activities of an established international automobile manufacturer...
kotarah [8:49]: Morning LEECO
nester [8:50]: this day is starting to feel funny. opens down and then completely sideways
madriver [8:50]: exactly the opposite of what I thought last night
LEECO [8:51]: Sideways is hard to trade -need trends
kotarah [8:51]: It's the Norm know Nester Maybe it a confusion thing so no one can guess I say sideways and down
jim [8:52]: the dollar is working against an up market but it is monday usually up
kotarah [8:52]: .S. equity futures are taking a breathier Monday snapping up four days of gains. Stocks are being pressured by worries of easing demand from China, a stronger dollar, and caution ahead of second quarter earnings season. The market's focus shifts entirely to earnings as the second quarter results season begins with Alcoa (AA) reporting after today's close. Per usual, tech companies and banks will dominate earnings out of the gate. The big names on the docket this week include Intel (INTC) and Google (GOOG) with JPMorgan (JPM), Bank of America (BAC), and Citigroup (C) closing up the week for which investors will be watching to see if credit trends
nester [8:52]: the overall trend is still down. we haven't broke up thru the trendline on the DOW yet
carr [8:53]: Good morning new trials. Please make sure you check out the tutorials tab. Lots of very good information there, and if you have questions, please feel free to ask.
madriver [8:53]: kot...looks like alot of buying in CYCC late friday
jim [8:54]: VVUS a watcher
kotarah [8:54]: I saw that mad I think it will go up and down for a while until news
madriver [8:55]: I'm starting to like Cycc....enough volume for me to pick that one up soon
kotarah [8:55]: Im looking to buy more on any dip
madriver [8:56]: kot...i'm looking at that as well....wasn't hot on that one but just looking...starting to like alot
kotarah [8:56]: VVUS rolling NESTER
kotarah [8:56]: M&A news: AON -7.7% (Aon to acquire Hewitt Associates for $50.00/share in cash and stock
kotarah [8:57]: Select financial related names showing weakness: AIB -4.5%, IRE -2.9%, STD -2.5%, DB -2.2%, LYG -2.4%, BBVA -2.1%, BCS -2.0%, NBG -1.6%, UBS -1.2%, ING -1.0%.
madriver [8:57]: andrew said he liked it last night ....looks like it's moving...
madriver [8:58]: kot...what platform do you use?
LEECO [8:58]: FAZ down premarket does someone knoe something we don"t?
kotarah [8:58]: EGLE NEWS on dry bulk shipping MAD
madriver [8:58]: leeco...set to open lower
madriver [8:59]: thanks kot...I'll take a look
kotarah [9:01]: S&P futures vs fair value: -4.00. Nasdaq futures vs fair value: -3.00.
carr [9:01]: Don't forget that July calls expire at the end of this week.
madriver [9:02]: kot...bdi looks bad but I think these stocks have so badly performed they may overperform soon IMO
madriver [9:03]: dbi
Treacherous_Cretin [9:03]: hello people
kotarah [9:03]: It's above the 50 MA and looks good on 3 m chart But remember It may be a down day MAD
Treacherous_Cretin [9:04]: looks as though knight got his rally...good for him
madriver [9:04]: hi TC
Treacherous_Cretin [9:04]: looks like the "immaculate erection" though....no volume and no catalyst
LEECO [9:05]: With lower opening -will it continue down-so trade bear ETF's?
Treacherous_Cretin [9:05]: is only normal for the market to revisit the 50 and 200 day moving averages at some point
Treacherous_Cretin [9:05]: doubt they will let the market up
LEECO [9:05]: mornng T
Treacherous_Cretin [9:06]: we should head south again soon. depends on how much they dress up earnings and accent the positive
Treacherous_Cretin [9:07]: AA will probably start the charade with everyone hyperventilating how much cash they have yet neglecting to look at or talk about their debt
Treacherous_Cretin [9:07]: lots of companies not worth a penny still trading
Treacherous_Cretin [9:08]: F is a good example of a corpse being dragged around like weekend at bernies
rw [9:08]: TC: I am glad to see you........Best of the day to you my good friend:
Treacherous_Cretin [9:08]: That will start to stink soon
Treacherous_Cretin [9:09]: thanks rw
nester [9:10]: morning TC. i love your comments...
Treacherous_Cretin [9:11]: hi nester
Treacherous_Cretin [9:11]: not sure what I said, but you are welcome
nester [9:11]: the "weekend at Bernies"
Treacherous_Cretin [9:11]: oh that
Treacherous_Cretin [9:12]: have you seen the balance sheet of F? LOL!
nester [9:12]: no, don't pay that much attention to fundies
Treacherous_Cretin [9:12]: it went up on that pension fund crap!
Treacherous_Cretin [9:12]: LOL
Treacherous_Cretin [9:13]: they have over $120 BILLION in debt and shareholders have negative equity of -5.5 Billion
lindo [9:14]: morning all
Treacherous_Cretin [9:14]: I don't trade fundies, but you have to laugh at the charade going on out there
carr [9:14]: morning lindo
Andrew [9:14]: Good morning.
jim [9:14]: morning Lindo
carr [9:14]: Morning Andrew
kotarah [9:14]: morning LINDO
rw [9:14]: Morning Lindo
rw [9:15]: andrew Jim
Treacherous_Cretin [9:15]: 25% of americans don't even have a good enough credit score to qualify for a car loan....if they even wanted a new car
lindo [9:15]: are you all bored?
rw [9:15]: Moderator Carr:
jim [9:15]: Morning RW
jim [9:15]: looks like Carr has been nominated as moderator
rw [9:16]: gap downs or early moves AON gap down GLW gap down maybe PM Long fairly soon RAI same.
jim [9:16]: Morning Andrew
carr [9:16]: morning RW
rw [9:17]: Certainly needed Jim.
Databob [9:17]: Best thing to do is get completely out of debt, something Govt seems unwilling to do
LEECO [9:17]: morning rw-see my 08
lindo [9:17]: Anyone have thoughts on buying puts on AA anticipating it will drop after earnings?
JayBird [9:17]: Earnings season gets started on Monday…
(all times are US ET)
9:00 am – Fed’s Lacker speaks in Richmond
10:00 am - Fed Chairman Bernanke speaks in Washington DC
1:00 pm - US Treasury’s $35B 3-yr auction
5:15 pm - Fed’s Duke speaks in Washington DC
Earnings
Before the Open:
SHAW
After the Close:
AA, CSX, NVLS
jim [9:17]: Morning JB
LEECO [9:18]: morning rw-see my 08
rw [9:18]: I think it is to much of a gamble Jim....
LEECO [9:18]: 08
LEECO [9:18]: ;46
rw [9:19]: I can not find nothign colonel leeco
LEECO [9:19]: morning lindo, jim-rw 08:46 post
rw [9:20]: however I sure would NOT sell puts on AA....so whom knows ------I would want the delta around 90 and deep in the money
madriver [9:21]: hi jb
lindo [9:21]: I
lindo [9:21]: thinking of buying. Figure AA will drop and puts will increase in value.
rw [9:22]: Colonel: I am extreemly troubled by the report at 46........Pray that they do Not take BKRPTCY........Maybe laws will prevail Pension guaranty act.......>??
nester [9:22]: i wouldn't sell puts on anything right now except inverse ETF's
jim [9:22]: agree with nester
lindo [9:22]: agreed nester. I have a GS I have to roll over or I'm in trouble
lindo [9:23]: a put I bought in April when I was optimistic
Andrew [9:24]: Potential resistance today could be in the SPY 108.00-108.50 range possibly.
nester [9:25]: jim - did you get filled on SOMX?
jim [9:25]: sold SOMX at 3.07 +2% will go back in in the 2.90's
kotarah [9:25]: Vivus: Do Avandia panel documents have any implication for Qnexa? - Wedbush (11.52)
Andrew [9:27]: I might be watching SOMX for a short again.
nester [9:29]: i still like VVUS short
LEECO [9:29]: rw-Chapt 11 is reorganization-Just hope no Chapt 7 which is goodbue
kotarah [9:29]: I knew you would and it looks like it will go down
kotarah [9:30]: AVNR
LEECO [9:30]: rw-I am not aware of "The pension Guarantee Act" hope my lawyer is
Andrew [9:31]: short STEC 15.46
rw [9:31]: leeco It guarantees pensions to people that are involved in bankrupt or insolvent companies ------
madriver [9:31]: Leeco....your lawyer better be aware of the PBGC or you might want to look for another attorney
rw [9:31]: andrew can fill you in on it
Andrew [9:32]: tripled up on STEC short 15.41
Andrew [9:32]: I'll look back at the chat.
lindo [9:33]: bought 5 AA puts. We shall see. This is a strategy in Gar's book.
nester [9:35]: thinking Retail tickers would be best to short as they went up late last week
ortrade [9:35]: FAZ 400s@14.87p
madriver [9:35]: http://www.pbgc.gov/workers-retirees/benefits-information/content/page789.html
jim [9:36]: L TUES 4.72
madriver [9:36]: leeco...go to there PBGC website if you want to get familiar with PBGC
jim [9:36]: L ZLC 1.60
Andrew [9:36]: Here's another page to check out Leeco...
Andrew [9:36]: http://www.pbgc.gov/workers-retirees/benefits-information/content/page13181.html
Andrew [9:37]: added to STEC short 15.53
LEECO [9:37]: Thanks very, very much to all for the support-will check PBGC
Andrew [9:38]: short SOMX 3.07
Andrew [9:38]: tripled up on SOMX short 3.05
rw [9:39]: PM up nicely also GLW
madriver [9:39]: jim...look at that candle on zlc
Andrew [9:39]: added to SOMX short 3.13 (double position)
jim [9:40]: Yep ZLC looks good
Andrew [9:41]: added to SOMX short 3.18 (double position)
nester [9:42]: VVUS moving quickly down
jim [9:43]: out TUES 4.85 +2.5%
LEECO [9:43]: I pulled up PBGC on Wikipedia-Againthanks makes me and I'm sure my wide feel better
nester [9:43]: good job jim
kotarah [9:43]: SOMX??
jim [9:43]: thxs Nester
nester [9:43]: still in at 3.03
kotarah [9:44]: good make money
ortrade [9:44]: exit FAZ -64p
kotarah [9:44]: I ll see it it holds
nester [9:44]: 3.01 close enough
kotarah [9:45]: AVNR continues up HOD
Andrew [9:45]: out SOMX -2.8%
ortrade [9:46]: FAZ 400s@14.83p
kotarah [9:46]: SOMX HOD
ortrade [9:47]: Add to FAZ 400s@14.79p
jim [9:47]: back in TUES 4.98
Andrew [9:47]: back short all SOMX 3.28
Treacherous_Cretin [9:47]: be well people
Treacherous_Cretin [9:47]: bye
LEECO [9:47]: By T_C- have a calm day
kotarah [9:48]: NO NEWS on SOMX
Andrew [9:48]: short RDN 8.32
nester [9:48]: can't find any on it
kotarah [9:48]: KERX
kotarah [9:48]: nothing NESTER
nester [9:49]: 3.50... watch
ortrade [9:49]: Add to FAZ 800s@14.76p
kotarah [9:49]: VOLUME ALERT ON SOMX
Andrew [9:50]: tripled up on RDN short 8.32
nester [9:50]: FAZ is makin me mad...
kotarah [9:50]: AFFY bouncing
kotarah [9:50]: AVNR
LEECO [9:51]: bear/bull is still green, as are all the trend lines-hope it stays in one direction
nester [9:51]: most of my charts are just ugly
Andrew [9:51]: It seems like we've had very light volume the first 20 minutes.
Andrew [9:53]: out half SOMX +2.1%
Andrew [9:54]: added back to SOMX short 3.20
Andrew [9:54]: added to RDN short 8.27 (double position)
jim [9:55]: out ZLC 1.67 +2%
nester [9:55]: added SOMX long 3.20
Hoecake [9:56]: morning everyone...
nester [9:57]: morning Hoe
kotarah [9:57]: AVNR AVNR HOD
Hoecake [9:57]: I do not like getting up at 6:30, I think I need to moved more to the east
Andrew [9:57]: AVNR is pulling off its high
Andrew [9:58]: On light volume though
Andrew [9:58]: out STEC -0.44%
lindo [9:58]: Stec is a crazy stock. Lost lots of $$ on it.
Andrew [9:59]: Possible short squeeze day in STEC following an analyst upgrade
nester [9:59]: LTD just won't die...
kotarah [10:00]: AVNR wont die either
nester [10:00]: kotarah - you still in AVNR ?
Andrew [10:00]: short AVNR 3.69 (double position)
kotarah [10:00]: yes big
nester [10:00]: think i may give you my keys then...
Andrew [10:01]: added to AVNR short 3.68
kotarah [10:01]: I gave it to you 2 weeks ago and IDIX both you and ANDREW said it looks great Came back in @ 3.03
Andrew [10:02]: added to AVNR short 3.67
nester [10:02]: i know.... the volume is the down side. i try to stay way from those under 3 million
kotarah [10:03]: It will come up for review very soon and it will have 10,000,000
nester [10:04]: volume slowing down on SOMX
rw [10:04]: aez trap door watacher only
madriver [10:04]: bwen looks pretty good
kotarah [10:04]: It does this crap a lot NEster thats why Im waiting to see why the surge
Andrew [10:05]: short DCTH 7.25 (triple position)
kotarah [10:06]: NEXMD buy 3000 @43.17
kotarah [10:06]: $ 3.17
rw [10:07]: JCP long watcher
Andrew [10:07]: short MPG 2.88 (double position)
Andrew [10:07]: out 1/4th SOMX +4%
Andrew [10:08]: out another 1/4th SOMX +3.7%
Andrew [10:08]: added to DCTH short 7.15
kotarah [10:09]: VVUS nice short
Andrew [10:09]: Yeah VVUS was an awesome short call
kotarah [10:10]: had some questionable news
Andrew [10:10]: added to MPG short 2.87 (double position)
nester [10:11]: PXP is now a good short again
Andrew [10:11]: out another 1/4th SOMX +4.6%
Hoecake [10:11]: I think we are heading into red for the day
JayBird [10:12]: Good.....cake....I need red...lots of red for SPY puts
kotarah [10:12]: AVNR + 10.8 %
Andrew [10:12]: out 1/4th DCTH +2.7%
Hoecake [10:12]: lol JB, I am thinking of grabbing some
nester [10:12]: good play Kotarah...
kotarah [10:12]: thx nester
nester [10:13]: i'm going to have to start being nicer to you know...
Andrew [10:13]: out 1/5th RDN +1.5%
kotarah [10:14]: JAso may be a short
Andrew [10:14]: added back to SOMX short 3.16
rw [10:16]: forgot about WLP looks good long durn it
Andrew [10:16]: added back to SOMX short 3.17
Andrew [10:18]: added back to DCTH short 7.08
Andrew [10:19]: added to MPG short 2.90 (double position)
Andrew [10:21]: out 1/4th AVNR +2.5%
Andrew [10:24]: out 1/3rd MPG tiny gain
nester [10:25]: finally, LTD tanked...
Andrew [10:26]: out 1/3rd SOMX +2.8%
Hoecake [10:27]: Do July options expire this friday
Andrew [10:27]: out another 1/5th RDN +2.3%
jim [10:29]: L ZLC 1.62
Andrew [10:30]: out another 1/4th AVNR +3%
ortrade [10:30]: Exit FAZ -220p
nester [10:30]: Hoe - options expire this friday
Hoecake [10:30]: Thanks Nes, I thought they did just wanted to double check
Andrew [10:33]: out rest of AVNR +3.6%
madriver [10:35]: bwen looked good early but it gave back almost everything since open
Andrew [10:37]: added back to MPG short 2.90 (double position)
Andrew [10:38]: added to DCTH short 7.15
Andrew [10:39]: added back to SOMX short 3.16
rw [10:39]: JCP long very soon
rw [10:40]: let WLP get away
Andrew [10:41]: added to DCTH short 7.19
nester [10:42]: VVUS down 5.3%
rw [10:43]: jcp on hold still wavering
ortrade [10:44]: FAZ 400@14.93p
rw [10:44]: going down now - looks very short......
ortrade [10:45]: Add to FAZ 400@14.92p
Andrew [10:46]: Extremely light volume for this time of day
ortrade [10:46]: Add to FAZ 800@14.94p
Andrew [10:46]: added to RDN short 8.11
nester [10:46]: your thought on WAG i have it long right now
Andrew [10:47]: It looks like a better short imo
Andrew [10:47]: But 28.14 could hold
nester [10:48]: i'm up just over 1% thinkin of bailing
madriver [10:48]: no mans land in my opinion on the 5 minute
Andrew [10:48]: out MPG -0.73%
Andrew [10:49]: Lots of profit-taking in AVNR
Andrew [10:49]: I probably should have kept some more going for longer
madriver [10:49]: iflg pulling back on that run up
Andrew [10:50]: SQNM is back close to lows
nester [10:50]: out WAG long +1.1%
Andrew [10:51]: short IFLG 6.12
nester [10:52]: FAZ moving north
Andrew [10:52]: WARNING: iflg looks like an extremely manipulated stock. Be careful if you trade it.
Andrew [10:55]: added to IFLG short 6.08
madriver [10:56]: shorted at 6.16......
rw [10:57]: Mr. Nester - good trade on WAG
madriver [10:57]: easy money....ha
nester [10:57]: thx rw...
nester [10:58]: lol... longs are not easy for me right now..
Andrew [10:58]: added to IFLG short 6.06
Andrew [10:59]: out IFLG -1.1%
madriver [10:59]: strange doings with IFLG....moves irratically
Andrew [11:00]: It has a ridiculous spread as well.
madriver [11:00]: wow.....
Andrew [11:01]: out 1/4th RDN +3.3%
madriver [11:01]: i'm out.
Hoecake [11:01]: XLF puts are dangerous but oh so tempting, I just cant make myself pull the trigger...
lindo [11:01]: iflg is in my dog bg. Tell me it's shooting up
Andrew [11:02]: It's having one of its short squeeze days it seems.
Andrew [11:02]: out another 1/4th RDN +3.6%
Andrew [11:03]: out 1/3rd DCTH +2.5%
iswing64 [11:03]: Out july FAZ 18 puts moments ago..part1 205% part 2 125%
madriver [11:04]: lindo...won't be the first time this stock spiked out of control
Andrew [11:04]: I'm glad I noticed DCTH coming across Traps. Its been a great short.
nester [11:05]: hey swing. good trade on your puts...
iswing64 [11:06]: thanks bud..loking to go the other way..
nester [11:06]: i got the $15 calls already. the $14's may be the way to go
Andrew [11:07]: out 1/4th remaining DCTH +3.1%
nester [11:07]: you made almost enough to buy that new bike now...
Andrew [11:08]: short BP 36.03 (triple position)
Andrew [11:10]: added to SOMX short 3.12
iswing64 [11:11]: Just got filled on aug 15 calls...camp out there for a bit..
Hoecake [11:12]: iswing faz calls?
Andrew [11:13]: out rest of RDN +3.5%
iswing64 [11:13]: Just a few hoe yes..
jim [11:13]: L ICO 4.23
Andrew [11:15]: back short IFLG 6.35 (double position)
Andrew [11:16]: added to IFLG short 6.33
madriver [11:17]: where is Knight when I need him....I need a read on the market...ha
rw [11:18]: GLW long 17.22
Andrew [11:21]: added to IFLG short 6.31
madriver [11:21]: andrw...how do you like those candles on IFLG......long....
Andrew [11:22]: I think it's much more likely for there to be continued volume bursts leading to new highs but if people start heading for the exit, it could fall faster.
madriver [11:22]: i agree...something very funky going on with that stock
Andrew [11:23]: Manipulation or pump and dump possibly
rw [11:24]: sold GLW even with comm
Andrew [11:24]: IFLG has a very low float as well so it can move a ton in either direction and will have an annoyingly large spread.
lindo [11:24]: i hate it
lindo [11:25]: but i need it to go up more
madriver [11:25]: are you getting the float from shortsqueeze?
Andrew [11:25]: Where did you buy it?
madriver [11:26]: i'm underwater 6.21
lindo [11:26]: 8.14
ortrade [11:27]: Exit FAZ +98$p
Andrew [11:27]: It was just looking at the total number of shares outstanding in Google finance
madriver [11:27]: today?
Andrew [11:27]: Back in May?
lindo [11:27]: If you're asking me, yes May
Andrew [11:27]: added to BP short 35.95
lindo [11:29]: worst one I'm holding
Andrew [11:29]: I don't think that's a good one to hold long-term since it has a high chance of being some kind of scam.
Andrew [11:29]: Its daily chart is highly suspicious. Just my opinion.
lindo [11:30]: I know. Maybe should sell it and take a loss,. Did you see something in Google finance that makes you think it's a scam?
madriver [11:30]: it's headed to the cellar today or tomorrow...who in their right mind won't take a 30% profit off the table........the answer probably scammers I guess
ortrade [11:30]: FAZ 400@15.05p
Andrew [11:30]: Just based on its chart patterns and how it has huge up days on little/no news.
lindo [11:31]: yes
lindo [11:31]: beta very high
Andrew [11:31]: That kind of chart screams 'I am probably a pump and dump'
madriver [11:31]: a stock to jump 30% multiple sessions just isn't normal IMO
lindo [11:31]: yes. Jumped in when I shouldn't have
madriver [11:31]: it isn't normal or we would all be very rich or poor
Andrew [11:32]: out 1/4th IFLG +3.5%
Andrew [11:32]: That should make up for my earlier loss in it.
nester [11:34]: swing - what did you do to upset FAZ ? falling back to $15 again
Andrew [11:34]: added to SOMX short 3.19
madriver [11:36]: Polanski is free.....wonders never cease!!!! Catch the barefoot bandit but let polanski free...nice!
ortrade [11:38]: Add to FAZ 400@15.06p
lindo [11:39]: you talking Roman Polanski?
madriver [11:40]: yes...yeah ....came up on yahoo...
Andrew [11:41]: out BP -0.2%
Andrew [11:42]: back short RDN 8.03 (triple position)
madriver [11:43]: knocking the ball out of the park on IFLG right now
Andrew [11:43]: Do you think it might go down to 5.50ish soon?
madriver [11:44]: andrw...if you still have that you gooda be up 5%
Andrew [11:44]: only about 2% actually
Andrew [11:45]: I'm holding out for a large move.
Andrew [11:45]: Since shorting it had a high chance of failure I need a winning trade in it to be huge.
madriver [11:45]: 5.60ish
Andrew [11:45]: Otherwise the risk/reward won't add up well.
Andrew [11:46]: Ideally I don't think I'll cover anymore until the 5.80s.
Andrew [11:47]: added to RDN short 8.01
Sandman [11:47]: Hi Guys---I played on emotion and lost 37.55%. Now I'm playing on a moving avg. system. I want to see how long it will take me to get back that 37.55%.
madriver [11:47]: the moves are crazy ...just up 300 now I'm flat
Andrew [11:48]: Sorry to hear that Sandman. Where did you lose it?
rw [11:49]: same here Sandman
madriver [11:49]: that is what yo call a large drawdown. Wish you the best
Sandman [11:49]: Starting today. I'll keep you posted how it's going.
Andrew [11:49]: IFLG's spread itself is often over 1%
madriver [11:50]: andrew...I shouldn't be trading to be quite honest....
madriver [11:50]: trading it
Sandman [11:51]: I'm just playing FAZand FAS.
ortrade [11:51]: Add to FAZ 800@15.05p
Andrew [11:51]: Trading IFLG is very high risk / high reward. I suggest using small share size so you can give it more wiggle room.
nester [11:52]: agree. that is the very reason that i don't trade low volume stocks. under 1million have to becareful as the volume may tick off and the price fall like a rock
madriver [11:53]: i hope it does fall like a rock Nestea
Andrew [11:53]: out 1/5th SOMX +1.7%
Andrew [11:53]: out another 1/4th DCTH +3.5%
Andrew [11:54]: IFLG's spread is now close to 1.8%. The market makers know it could go crazy soon in one direction so they need a huge spread in order to compensate for the risk.
madriver [11:54]: andrew...risk mgmt...understood for the most part.....
lindo [11:54]: Daily chart on IFLG makes me hopeful that mid august I might be able to get out even.
nester [11:54]: short IFLG 6.10
Andrew [11:55]: I wouldn't read much into the daily chart. It could all just be made up.
lindo [11:55]: you are making me sad
Andrew [11:55]: If you're holding IFLG long-term you need to do a ton of research on the actual company itself.
madriver [11:55]: lol
Andrew [11:55]: sorry
ortrade [11:56]: Exit FAZ -140p
Andrew [11:56]: My point is to do a ton of research b/c there seem to be a lot of red flags.
lindo [11:56]: I could take 1000 loss, or keep holding. Hae KPMG as there accountants, so says the NYT financials
lindo [11:57]: I am so sorry I did it, but hate to think about giving back 1000
madriver [11:57]: KPMG....was Enron's I believe
lindo [11:57]: mad
madriver [11:57]: in my opinion that is irrelevant
lindo [11:57]: I grabbing at straws
madriver [11:58]: I would dump on this runup but don't take my advice......
lindo [11:58]: down goes iflg
lindo [11:58]: I'm thinking about it mad
Andrew [11:58]: Even if the company itself is legit, there could also just be 3rd parties manipulating the stock price.
lindo [11:59]: true, I suppose Andrew
kotarah [11:59]: buy 2000 SQNM @2.84
madriver [11:59]: I always look at it from a point of view of what's normal....30% in one day is not
kotarah [12:00]: Buy 3500 AVNR
kotarah [12:00]: AVNR @ 3.52
jim [12:01]: Kot did you mean 5.84 for SQNM?
kotarah [12:01]: Yes 5.84
jim [12:01]: thxs
kotarah [12:02]: ok JIM
lindo [12:02]: need pumping of iflg
ortrade [12:02]: FAZ 800s@14.93p
kotarah [12:02]: your on your own there
lindo [12:02]: lol
porti [12:02]: just having my best trade of the year, i am riding yrcw $$$$ boy i am happy now :)))
kotarah [12:02]: I see SOMX still hanging in
ortrade [12:03]: Add FAZ 800s@14.9p
Andrew [12:03]: Yes, SOMX is establishing a nice base in the 3.10s but hasn't been able to get past 3.20. I'm short with an avg. price of 3.174 currently.
kotarah [12:04]: You still own Nester??
Willie2 [12:04]: Porti me tooo its about time up big time today, think it will continu to $2.00 ?
nester [12:04]: SOMX?
kotarah [12:04]: yes
nester [12:04]: averaged in at 3.10
kotarah [12:04]: Hope 3.50 for ya today
porti [12:05]: this peace of junk, is recovering 1/3 my losses with other stuff.... i feel good!
carr [12:05]: Hey jolox are you out there
jolox [12:05]: I feel like Nelson Mandel... THANK YOU
carr [12:05]: welcome back
nester [12:06]: lol
jolox [12:06]: Mandela........he wasn't Jewish
Willie2 [12:07]: Mandela a black red
Andrew [12:08]: added to RDN short 8.12
jolox [12:08]: As I was saying before I was interrupted.......Options is the only game in town!!
jolox [12:09]: Options are
Andrew [12:09]: added back to DCTH short 7.07
jim [12:10]: out ICO 4.33 +2%
jolox [12:12]: Sold AMD JULY 7.OO CALLS +30%
nester [12:13]: we are green ? why?
Andrew [12:13]: Sellers might just be taking a break and with the low volume it doesn't take as much to drive us up or down.
nester [12:14]: ruining all my shorts
Andrew [12:14]: Yeah, me too
carr [12:14]: nester my longs need a break
Andrew [12:14]: added to RDN short 8.15
kotarah [12:14]: Mine too
Andrew [12:15]: added to DCTH short 7.16
ortrade [12:15]: Exit RFAZ +146$p
ortrade [12:15]: meant FAZ
kotarah [12:15]: LOOK at PLA
Andrew [12:15]: long FAZ 14.82
ortrade [12:15]: FAZ 400@14.82p
carr [12:16]: I know many of you don't like TRIN but it has been below 1 for most of the day
madriver [12:16]: it appears IFLG is finally breaking down.IMO
nester [12:16]: the only longs i have are SOMX and FAZ and FAZ is a bear
Andrew [12:16]: Insane spread still
lindo [12:16]: pumpers are at lunch now Mad
kotarah [12:16]: Mine AVNR SQNM CYCC KERX NEXMD
kotarah [12:17]: looking at TRIN
Andrew [12:17]: tripled up on FAZ 14.84
madriver [12:17]: taking midday nap
ortrade [12:17]: Add to FAZ 400@14.84p
nester [12:17]: added to IFLG short 5.92
Andrew [12:19]: added to DCTH short 7.24
ortrade [12:20]: Add to FAZ 800@14.84p
jolox [12:21]: Bought 3 July VALE calls @ 2.30
Andrew [12:22]: added to DCTH short 7.28
Andrew [12:22]: out another 1/4th IFLG +7.2%
nester [12:23]: wow your going very well today Andrew
Andrew [12:23]: added to FAZ 14.86
Andrew [12:24]: I've been trying to focus more on cheaper stocks today.
Andrew [12:24]: Losses can be bigger but so can the gains on a % basis.
nester [12:24]: PXP is running north rather well
kotarah [12:26]: sold 3500 AVNR @ 3.62 + $350
Andrew [12:26]: Nice one
kotarah [12:27]: thx ANDREW
Andrew [12:27]: I almost jumped on board at 3.52
Andrew [12:27]: and then later at 3.48
kotarah [12:27]: Best you missed VVUS
nester [12:28]: kotarah - you have any left?
kotarah [12:28]: VVUS ?
kotarah [12:28]: AVNR ?
carr [12:28]: Heading out for lunch see you later all
nester [12:28]: no, AVNR
madriver [12:28]: i'm out ilfg...4.9%......patience is running thin
madriver [12:29]: thx carr
kotarah [12:29]: NO more will rebuy again if it pulls back a little
Andrew [12:29]: short AVNR 3.62 (double position)
kotarah [12:30]: NDX 10 Worst % Performers:
GRMN, ILMN, WYNN, JOYG, FWLT, FSLR, FLIR, URBN, QGEN, LIFE
Andrew [12:30]: added to AVNR 3.61
kotarah [12:30]: NDX 10 Best % Performers:
SNDK, QCOM, CMCSA, MRVL, STX, SYMC, MSFT, GOOG, DISH, LRCX
Andrew [12:31]: out 1/3rd DCTH tiny loss
nester [12:32]: should have bought TZA calls on that pullback...
Andrew [12:33]: added to AVNR short 3.63
nester [12:34]: Andrew - AMAT about to fall hard
Andrew [12:35]: I don't think AMAT will have much more downside.
nester [12:35]: i see it under $12 easy
Andrew [12:35]: Oh actually that volume there is pretty good.
ortrade [12:36]: Exit FAZ -20p
ortrade [12:40]: FAZ 1600s@14.76p
Andrew [12:41]: added to FAZ 14.75
Treacherous_Cretin [12:41]: how goes the trading?
madriver [12:41]: can I post a link to paid website.....has some interesting information for all.....it's nothing really new but interesting stuff.
Andrew [12:42]: added back to DCTH short 7.29
madriver [12:42]: sidways pretty much
nester [12:42]: mad - i wouldn't
Andrew [12:42]: Hi TC. Light volume today. It's not taking much to move the market.
madriver [12:42]: okay....
madriver [12:43]: not promoting the site just kinda interesting.....won't post. Not a member myself
Andrew [12:43]: added to RDN short 8.16 (double position)
Treacherous_Cretin [12:43]: they will probably wait for the earning junk to start before taking direction
Treacherous_Cretin [12:44]: this volume is useless
Treacherous_Cretin [12:44]: hard to justify shorts with that trin though
Andrew [12:46]: Shorting near 108.00-108.50 in SPY I think is pretty low risk.
nester [12:46]: hard to justify much of anything. just pick a trend and hold on to it.
Andrew [12:47]: out half RDN -0.27%
Treacherous_Cretin [12:48]: this time of day, with this volume and lack of a trend means the best trade is no trade...for me anyway
Treacherous_Cretin [12:48]: probably should not even be trading anyways
Andrew [12:48]: added back to RDN short 8.09
ortrade [12:48]: Exit FAZ -220p
Treacherous_Cretin [12:49]: going to nap
Treacherous_Cretin [12:49]: bye
Andrew [12:49]: Bye
nester [12:49]: c'ya TC
nester [12:49]: ortrade - you buying option or the stock?
lindo [12:49]: bye TC
jolox [12:50]: Alot of stocks...like VALE.....are in up trends and fall back on a day like this to take a rest......if you can find the right stocks off of Gar's option list....like VALE.....OPTIONS ARE CHEAP NEAR EXPERATIUON.....they have a tendecy to return to up trending ways.
Andrew [12:51]: VALE is in a big downtrend longer-term.
Andrew [12:51]: It has a nice consoldation going though between 23.50 and 28.00.
jolox [12:52]: Andy...this is a short term play.....options expire on Friday.
Andrew [12:52]: Oh ok.
madriver [12:53]: I don't agree with a long term down trend either.....it probably going to go where the market goes????
Andrew [12:54]: added to AVNR short 3.66
madriver [12:55]: andrew...just looked at that chart....maybe you are right...not a very convincing chart to me
jolox [12:56]: YOUR RIGHT ON......MAD.......Gar recommends you only hold options up to 5-6 days.
Andrew [12:56]: out SOMX -0.82%
Hoecake [12:56]: What does the NYSE Tick number at the top of SV mean?
madriver [12:56]: postive or negative.....buying and selling
Andrew [12:57]: It's a comparison between the number of stocks that were just bought on the ask I think compared to sold on the bid in that one instant.
Hoecake [12:57]: gotcha
madriver [12:58]: andrw what did you think of that site......not too exciting?
kotarah [12:58]: Does that recommendation apply to long term out of the money stocks 1 1/2 years as well JOLOX ??
ortrade [12:59]: FAZ 1600@14.88p
Andrew [12:59]: I thought it was a free site before. I've seen a couple of interesting articles every now and then but not usually anything too useful. Kind of interesting though I guess.
Andrew [13:00]: out 1/5th FAZ +1%
madriver [13:00]: I got an email about 3 months ago to sign up which i did not....but they appear to give some free info.
Andrew [13:00]: out 1/5th DCTH +1.3%
Andrew [13:02]: I kind of view paying for general financial/stock market info as a waste of money.
ortrade [13:02]: Interestingly today all my trades on FAZ but one were at one point or another above +100$p pertrade. most of them turned around and took overall losses. It is not easy trading on stop loss as profit instead of on trend.
kotarah [13:03]: SOMX hanging in NESTER
madriver [13:03]: agree...most of stuff is free!!!!
madriver [13:03]: Nester....still holding IFLG?
nester [13:04]: kotarah - it is doing well today. this is the first time in a while that it hasn't fell back to zero for the day
nester [13:04]: mad - still have it short, yes
kotarah [13:04]: I noticed that it's acually getting sronger
madriver [13:04]: you're in the money then....
nester [13:05]: yes, i'm averaged in at 5.99
Andrew [13:05]: out AVNR -1.4%
kotarah [13:05]: out of the money stocks only with possible doubles MAD
Andrew [13:05]: out another 1/5th DCTH +2%
nester [13:06]: would love to see SOMX's volume at + 4mil
kotarah [13:06]: AVNR scared the hell out of you ANDREW
Andrew [13:06]: These biotechs are confusing intraday.
madriver [13:06]: jolox....are you way out of the money on VALE?
kotarah [13:06]: Buy 2000 AVNR @ 3.70
Andrew [13:07]: Yeah, I thought there would be more sellers trying to undercut each other at these levels. AVNR will probably want to go make a new high again now.
nester [13:07]: SOMX near 3.30
kotarah [13:07]: go NESTER
kotarah [13:07]: Ill help carrying the money
nester [13:08]: deal...
kotarah [13:08]: I think it will break out very soon
Andrew [13:09]: back short SOMX 3.27
nester [13:09]: i couldn't believe it dropped below $4... that was where it was before the approval
Andrew [13:09]: tripled up on SOMX short 3.26
kotarah [13:10]: I cant either
LEECO [13:10]: Back from some tasks-lawyer (who has to get another on BK and another to rep us in Deleware where the BK is being filed) and get black algae further under comrol, and deal with gradchildren's custody suit lawyer. Other than that leisure to observe a squirrely market LOL
kotarah [13:10]: you may well get the 3.50 today NESTER and without news
Andrew [13:10]: It certainly is rather squirrely today.
madriver [13:11]: lecco....none of that sounds fun to me
Andrew [13:11]: added to SOMX short 3.24
nester [13:11]: it may... need a bit more volume on it. when you posted the Volume runner earlier, i thought we would be hitting about 6mil today
kotarah [13:12]: The S&P 500 Financial Index has pushed to its best levels since June 28 as it hit 195.84 on reports that Mass Senator Scott Brown will support the bill that will be put in front of Senate this week. Still the sector has once again run into resistance at the 195.50-196.00 area as it awaits the first salvo of earnings from heavy hitters such as JPM, BAC, and C this week. The sector has been pushing higher ahead of the reports but plenty of concern remains and a poor numbers will likely erase recent gains.
LEECO [13:12]: At least Bear/Bull longterm, daily & i hr trend is green-What does that point to in daily trading strategy?
kotarah [13:13]: I placed an alert on volume it went off very early still has decent Volume though
Andrew [13:13]: out rest of DCTH +1.6%
LEECO [13:13]: Decent Col is not -55.83%
nester [13:14]: it will run nuts once the volume goes over 4.5million
kotarah [13:14]: 2.4 MIL more to come most are scared because its moving on no news
Hoecake [13:14]: I cannot decide if it would be better to do a FAZ Call for Aug @ 15.00 or do a XLF AUG 15 put...
Andrew [13:14]: A lot of my best trades have come from Big Cheapy Action today.
kotarah [13:14]: I'll be back in like white on rice
nester [13:15]: agreed... i see $4 easy when the volume ticks up
kotarah [13:16]: Despite strength among tech stocks, which collectively make up the largest sector by market weight, the broader market has struggled to find its direction today... An early gain was quickly reversed by a broad-based selling effort. Even the Nasdaq, which had been up roughly 0.8% at its session high, was sent to a loss. Several large-cap tech plays like Google (GOOG 475.42, +7.93) and Intel (INTC 20.53, +0.29) have continued to outperform, but Apple (AAPL 257.44, -2.18) has been weak. CNBC gave word that Consumer Report cannot recommend the iPhone 4 due to the handset's problem with reception. Overall, tech stocks are up 0.4% at the moment... Materials stocks remain under stiff pressure. The sector is down 1.2% as steel stocks (-3.7%) and diversified metals and miners (-4.6%) retreat ahead of the latest figures from Dow component Alcoa (AA 10.84, -0.10), which is scheduled to report after the close. Most market participants will take their cues from the company's outlook... Energy stocks are also under pressure, no thanks to lower oil prices, which are presently down 1.2% to $75.10 per barrel. While the energy sector is down 0.6% at the moment, embattled energy giant BP Plc (BP 36.71, +2.66) is up for the fifth straight session as the company progresses in its efforts to stem the flow of oil from its leaking rig in the Gulf of Mexico. There has also been some renewed speculation about a takeover...
Andrew [13:16]: back short BP 36.69 (triple position)
ortrade [13:17]: Exit FAZ -200p
Andrew [13:18]: added back to FAZ 14.75
Andrew [13:19]: added back to RDN short 8.15
kotarah [13:19]: VVUS almost down $1
kotarah [13:22]: AVNR HOD
rko [13:23]: AA $11 Strike Jul10 Exp: 10 Calls @ .29 AND 10 Puts @ .39 (cost of spread $680)
Andrew [13:27]: back short AVNR 3.72
kotarah [13:27]: Buy 1500 AVNR total position 3500 @ 3.72
lindo [13:28]: The puts I bought on AA this morning aren't doing much. I need AA to drop thru a hole on earnings.
Andrew [13:29]: Broker dealers are getting cute with internalizing orders in AVNR near 3.72
Andrew [13:29]: tripled up on AVNR short 3.72
Andrew [13:30]: out SOMX -1.3%
kotarah [13:30]: 0.02 of High NESTER SOMX
jolox [13:33]: Lindo.....AA has heavy call sentiment......not much room to go up......even with good earnings.....doubt it with glut of bauxite......it can go down..like ORCL...MU....INTC....etc
Andrew [13:33]: back short all SOMX 3.29
lindo [13:34]: down would be ok by me
jolox [13:35]: With heavy call sentiment and great earnings.....there is no guarantees your going up inthis market.
Andrew [13:35]: added to FAZ 14.75
nester [13:36]: 3.30 now...
kotarah [13:36]: I see
kotarah [13:36]: ALAX HOD
nester [13:37]: up 12% on nothin and no real increase on volume... go figure
Hoecake [13:37]: ok pulled the trigger, FAZ Aug 15.00 calls
kotarah [13:37]: Huge Volume surge this morning now it has definately tapered off
ortrade [13:39]: FAZ looks like hell on 5min chart..
Andrew [13:40]: It's just following the overall market.
kotarah [13:40]: SOMX short interest 3.90% slightly down
nester [13:40]: all my charts look like that no direction except for VVUS
Andrew [13:40]: added to SOMX short 3.31
kotarah [13:40]: VVUS was a gift
nester [13:41]: did you grab that one this morning?
kotarah [13:41]: no
nester [13:41]: lol... me either. had to dump one to get into something else. have too many right now.
kotarah [13:42]: I had to go out and was not sur until news came out then I was sure
ortrade [13:44]: on 5min faz has been in a divergent consolidation since 12.10 the worst enemy of the pro and best friend of the novice..
Andrew [13:44]: Don't pros love divergent consolidations?
Andrew [13:44]: Since it's so easy to take money from newbies getting stopped out?
Andrew [13:45]: out SOMX -1.1%
kotarah [13:46]: SOMX HOD
nester [13:46]: yup... up 6% so far...
Andrew [13:46]: Blowing past the 10-day moving avg. now.
kotarah [13:46]: 0.15 and you'll get your wish NESTER
ortrade [13:47]: The newbies hold. In divergent consolidation they always win. Pros use stop losses and divergent consolidations will always trigger stop losses. easy to see..
lindo [13:47]: I don't really understand divergent consolidation. Means indicators don't jibe??
Andrew [13:47]: Oh I see.
kotarah [13:47]: HITS 4 it will be off to the races on what? I dont know
Andrew [13:47]: It means lower low, higher high, even lower low, even higher high.
Andrew [13:48]: Stuff like that can be very annoying.
ortrade [13:48]: divergent consolidation is price that wiggles amongst two trendlines that move away from each other.
lindo [13:48]: bars lined up?
Andrew [13:48]: out AVNR +1.3%
nester [13:48]: we need a bit more volume to hit $4 not sure it will do that soon
kotarah [13:48]: 3 mil and going
Andrew [13:49]: out 1/3rd FAZ tiny gain, out 1/3rd RDN tiny loss
nester [13:49]: i really thought we would have about 5mil at this time
Andrew [13:49]: added back to IFLG short 6.20
kotarah [13:49]: The spike early faded has not awoke yet
nester [13:50]: bumping stop to 3.31
Andrew [13:50]: back short SOMX 3.40 (double position)
Andrew [13:51]: added to SOMX short 3.39 (double position)
nester [13:51]: got stopped out IFLG -2%
Andrew [13:52]: out rest of IFLG tiny loss
ortrade [13:53]: The only solution in surviving a divergent consolidation ( if you are keen to trade it is to put up with smaller gains. And remember there is not such thing of saying I should have traded that pattern this or that way. At the trading time it is hard to know how the pattern will change. The fictitious estimation of the past patterns has little to do with trading the now.
picker304 [13:54]: Welcome trials. Hope you enjoy your visit but more than that we hope you become a part of the family
Andrew [13:54]: The market feels like it wants to rally, but come 2:00pm it might get slammed down a bit.
kotarah [13:54]: 88.5950.. EUR/USD: 1.2690
lindo [13:55]: that surprises
Andrew [13:55]: out half FAZ -0.64%
kotarah [13:56]: Out NEXMD no gain no losss
nester [13:56]: have another meeting back in an hour or so...
kotarah [13:56]: have fun
Andrew [13:56]: added back to RDN short 8.19
Andrew [13:57]: added back to FAZ 14.72 (double position)
kotarah [13:58]: VVUS being slaughtered
ortrade [14:00]: Today I learned that estimating exits targets and stop loss is as crucial as the entries. I dont think just using fixed stop loss and exit target is really sufficient.
madriver [14:00]: kerx no doing so swell today either
ortrade [14:00]: FAZ 1600s@14.70p
kotarah [14:01]: Not yet MAD it will
kotarah [14:01]: I own at #.57 2500 and will buy more going down from here
madriver [14:01]: actually might be good time to buy?
madriver [14:02]: .57 cents?
madriver [14:03]: 3.57
kotarah [14:03]: The entry point is critical ortrade I have gotten it down now without too many failures
madriver [14:03]: looked at the # an keyboard
kotarah [14:03]: $3.57 was bought KERX waiting to buy more MAD
kotarah [14:04]: 5000 CYCC was bought @ 1.53 waiting to buy more
madriver [14:05]: I believe you'll do well. I am going to probably pick up CYCC here shortly
Andrew [14:05]: added to FAZ 14.70
ortrade [14:05]: kotarh, today till now most of my entries on FAZ were are some point +100$p.. when I exited total losses add to -704$p.
madriver [14:06]: ortrade...you know what they call that?
kotarah [14:06]: My entry was on the money it has held for over a week stops are key
ortrade [14:06]: they call it mad driving.. lol..
Andrew [14:07]: lol
madriver [14:07]: they call that persistent bad trading....jk.....keep going back for more losses
kotarah [14:07]: not good Ortrade
Andrew [14:08]: out 1/4th SOMX +2.2%
ortrade [14:08]: madriver, we are all open to you teaching us with posted entries exits and number of shares..
madriver [14:08]: mad trading I guess
picker304 [14:08]: Are we making $ today SV family?
kotarah [14:09]: AVNR coming down may be a good buy here
madriver [14:09]: ortrade...jk means just kidding and number 2 as i said before I am not a full time trader....I may make 2 trades a day and sometimes only one.
jolox [14:10]: Only people with CSCO calls are making money today.
Andrew [14:10]: I really shouldn't have taken profits so quickly with AVNR. I think that was one of my worst trades of the day.
lindo [14:10]: jk is good for you Mad
carr [14:10]: Picker BPAX is up a few cents on the day :-)
picker304 [14:10]: Lets go carr you jump in I'll follow
madriver [14:10]: lindo...what is that supposed to mean?
lindo [14:10]: You do a lot of jking
ortrade [14:11]: kotarh. during large intraday volatility it is very comon to hit stop losses very fast.. each two or three bars retrace strongly.. it is why I insisted in figuring out how do deal with the the stops and targets in such markets..
lindo [14:11]: I mean that in a nice way
kotarah [14:11]: ALXA HOD
madriver [14:11]: sorry...it's kinda boring otherwise IMO
madriver [14:11]: lindo...not offended.
lindo [14:11]: kidding is good
Andrew [14:11]: IFLG got me out at 6.31 :(
lindo [14:12]: watching it all day
madriver [14:12]: I grew up with 8 sisters and 3 brothers....you had to be able to kid around
lindo [14:12]: wow
kotarah [14:12]: NO TELEVISIONS ?/
lindo [14:13]: reality show right there
rw [14:13]: UVV is a great daily trading stock...Litle volume but relatively safe
jolox [14:13]: Parents must be Catholic.
madriver [14:13]: my mom had 15 children...crazy
lindo [14:13]: jk
madriver [14:13]: catholic.....you bet....me not so much
Andrew [14:14]: UVV had a nice clean breakout but that 11:00-1:00pm movemen was pretty nasty.
picker304 [14:14]: Wow Mad get them all to sign up here and we won't have to do anymore advertising lol
madriver [14:14]: picker.....yeah if any of the others traded...most in health care fields
lindo [14:15]: good field to be in
picker304 [14:15]: Darn well thats good though
rw [14:15]: sold JCP 22.58
jolox [14:15]: Old Irish saying......Mother who has given birt to more than eight children.....goes straight to heaven.
madriver [14:16]: yeah....my mom as as irish as they get
picker304 [14:16]: Any in mental health field lot of us could use some serious help
jolox [14:16]: birth.....still rusty.
ortrade [14:16]: lol..
kotarah [14:16]: Do you hear voices PICk
madriver [14:16]: pick...actually not....nurses,doctor,.......mostly nurses(RN)
picker304 [14:18]: No kot but I see numbers in my sleep
madriver [14:18]: father was a pathologist but has passed on
kotarah [14:18]: I want to know what happened at playboy someone messed with the bunnies stock up 1.50
picker304 [14:18]: So sorry Mad lost mine a while back too
madriver [14:18]: kot...want to take Playboy private
Andrew [14:18]: added to FAZ 14.778
Andrew [14:18]: 14.77
kotarah [14:19]: I have the same symptoms PICk
picker304 [14:19]: We need help kot
ortrade [14:19]: Exit FAZ -200p
madriver [14:19]: i think way to much about numbers before falling to sleep.....
Andrew [14:20]: out another 1/4th SOMX +3.1%
jolox [14:20]: How come the older we get......the smarter our father gets ??
picker304 [14:20]: Mine always have a minus sign before them how about you?
madriver [14:20]: actually I think about stocks and about crap I read during the day
picker304 [14:20]: Man jolox good point
lindo [14:20]: I do that too, Wish I dream up a good pick
madriver [14:21]: good point jolox.....that's life process I think
kotarah [14:21]: Just look at it this way when you get to 60 you'll be able to piss like a 4 year old and hit two urinals at the same time
jolox [14:21]: look at Cabela.....CAB
picker304 [14:21]: LOL wouldn't that be nice. Maybe we should try palm reading or something of that nature
madriver [14:21]: ohhhh
lindo [14:22]: tea leaves
lindo [14:22]: jk
jolox [14:22]: After 60.......sex is number before seven.
karenbcz [14:23]: Is NESTER here today?
kotarah [14:23]: in meeting
madriver [14:23]: he was around
karenbcz [14:23]: NESTER????
carr [14:23]: yes nester had quite a few meetings today
kotarah [14:23]: IN MEETING
karenbcz [14:24]: k. thx.
ortrade [14:24]: FAZ 1600s@14.79p
carr [14:24]: Whats up karen?
picker304 [14:24]: Dang market wish itd make up its mind
kotarah [14:25]: UP UP AND AWAY
picker304 [14:25]: Still think its north for awhile Really really do
picker304 [14:25]: with some fakes along the way
kotarah [14:26]: See AFFY slowly moving ANDREW maybe you should kill it
kotarah [14:26]: just joking
Andrew [14:26]: out RDN tiny loss
kotarah [14:27]: Out SQNM LOSS -280
Andrew [14:27]: I think AFFY has a high chance of bouncing in the 6.20s.
madriver [14:27]: speaking of out of his mind......Mel Gibson my Lord......
porti [14:27]: Newbie Question and it has certainly been answered before... Nyse Volume Change compares to what? last 3 Months, last Week ? Anybody that can answer gets one Zillion Dollars $$$
picker304 [14:28]: Man trivia Can't rmember 6 months Andrew?
picker304 [14:28]: Carr Karen don't like you LOL
Andrew [14:28]: I think it's closer to 2 years
picker304 [14:29]: doesn't
madriver [14:29]: average of 2 years?
Andrew [14:29]: At least
picker304 [14:29]: Yea right I remember now a long time lol
madriver [14:29]: ok....that's good to know...I did not know how i calc'd that
porti [14:30]: I am just explaining this sv to my work colleaque, and its embarassing for me... he is asking to much questions!!!
picker304 [14:30]: lol
Andrew [14:30]: Whereas the % volume change column in the Stocks tab I think looks more just at the volume avg. the last 30 days or so.
madriver [14:31]: tell him to sign up himself and leave you alone porti!!! jk
porti [14:31]: Is this documented somewhere?
madriver [14:31]: yeah in Gar's head
Andrew [14:31]: Gar's mentioned it before. It might be in the archives.
LEECO [14:31]: Average volume on NYSE is 10 days-says so right onmy E-trade site
madriver [14:32]: I see what u mean andrew....
kotarah [14:32]: A look at the 10 biggest percentage decliners on Nasdaq at 1 p.m.:Dehaier Medical Sys fell 13.2 percent to $5.18.SI Financial Group Inc. fell 12.1 percent to $6.15.Oak Valley Bancorp fell 8.9 percent to $5.01.Vivus Inc. fell 7.6 percent to $10.64.Sequenom Inc. fell 7.6 percent to $5.75.MSB Financial Corp. fell 7.5 percent to $6.68.Acxiom Corp. fell 7.5 percent to $13.47.Delcath Systems Inc. fell 7.4 percent to $7.11.Newport Bancorp fell 7.3 percent to $11.35.Natures Sunshine fell 7.0 percent to $8.26.
Andrew [14:32]: Each piece of software can calculate it differently Leeco. It's only etrade that has chosen 10 days.
Sandman [14:33]: Andrew I think it's based on last years avg. volume.
Andrew [14:33]: out another 1/4th SOMX +4.3%
porti [14:33]: Thanks for the answers, i will give the zillions to gar, he will be the only guy to know :-)
porti [14:34]: And i will tell my work colleage to f ....off, thanks for the tips! He's laughing his head off right now..
madriver [14:35]: f off......porti you are quite a nice guy.....jk
madriver [14:35]: what are friends for anyway...
porti [14:35]: well, we know each other for 7 years, so no Problem there
madriver [14:36]: sounds like a special relationship
ortrade [14:37]: Market displayed today tremedous skill on FAZ. Each apparent trading pattern was continued with a total differnt one infliciting large losses to traders. At the same time it broaden the range kept shuffling pattern begginings.. and terminating them right away the moment sufficient traders fell into the trap.
porti [14:38]: it was boring today at work and i showed him the gap down, and we bought on paper aon 35.25, and look at it :-)
LEECO [14:39]: Yahoo carries a ten day & 3 month av. Vol.
ortrade [14:39]: These scenarios occurs when prospective entries are balance that is both on the short and on the long side.. Today patterns on FAZ 5min look like genetically engineered mutants..
Andrew [14:41]: back short IFLG 6.18
Andrew [14:43]: out rest of SOMX +4%
madriver [14:44]: Out of curiosity can participants here tell us/me what % you were up last year. I was up pretty big but have not replicated so far this year
kotarah [14:45]: Buy 2500 SQNM @5.63
Andrew [14:45]: tripled up on IFLG short 6.17
madriver [14:45]: guess not.......
Andrew [14:46]: I can give you some paper trade numbers if you're curious but it's kind of meaningless.
madriver [14:47]: that's okay just kinda wondering....
Andrew [14:47]: +354% but keep in mind that includes the unprecedented volatility from January-April
Andrew [14:48]: About 2/3rds of the profits were in those months
madriver [14:48]: you did way better than me........I was at 150% ye 2009
rw [14:49]: fas long 22.11
madriver [14:50]: mostly from F hold but alot from ASH
Andrew [14:50]: 2009 can be a pretty meaningless year. Day traders could have done super largely just because of January -April and buy-and-holders could have done amazing if they got their timing well and bought from March-June and just kept on holding.
carr [14:50]: Mad in 2009 I made just over $96K this year I am down just over $5K
madriver [14:51]: you hit it andrw...I bought what turned out to be the bottom right around March 12 2009
madriver [14:52]: near the bottom anyway
Andrew [14:52]: added to IFLG short 6.24
madriver [14:52]: carr...you're hanging in there this year.....
carr [14:53]: Yeah but I would like to be up on the year, I was a couple of month ago, but made some bad decisions.
jolox [14:54]: Once my PEIX.....SEED and TGB comes in I'll be up 4000%.
Treacherous_Cretin [14:54]: MOS is getting beaten to death today.
carr [14:54]: bad jolox bad LOL I own two out of the 3
kotarah [14:54]: MOS is trading ~8.0% lower following news in an 8-K today where the co issued a conditional "WARN" notice to 221 mine employees advising them that in 60 days the Co's South Fort Meade, Florida, phosphate rock mine may close indefinitely. The Co issued the WARN notice because of a lawsuit filed on June 30, 2010 by Sierra Club.
Treacherous_Cretin [14:54]: a lot more than other fertilizers
Treacherous_Cretin [14:55]: okay thanks k
kotarah [14:55]: k
madriver [14:55]: jolox.....i wouldn't be counting on those picks
Andrew [14:55]: added to IFLG short 6.30
jolox [14:55]: OH........4000% part 1.
ortrade [14:55]: Interestingly FAZ has established a 14.73 resistance and it refused to go below that line till now today..
madriver [14:55]: lol
Andrew [14:55]: out IFLG -1.9%
rw [14:56]: Long term april 2009 thru april 2010 made 12%.....April, May, June 2010 Made $3.00. or not even a hundredth of a percent But on day trading making about $150 a day
madriver [14:56]: andrw....i gave up on iflg....maybe tomorrow it will crash and burn
Andrew [14:56]: back short all IFLG 6.30
Andrew [14:57]: It's a pretty nasty one.
rw [14:57]: Out of FAS 22.05 that was on paper - which means nothing to me. forgot to post that
jolox [14:58]: SNIC ??
Treacherous_Cretin [14:58]: why would TZA be up so much today?
madriver [14:58]: people like small caps
madriver [14:58]: don't like small caps I should say
Andrew [14:58]: The Russell 2000 gapped up today and got killed from 10:00-11:00am
rw [14:58]: Treacherous_Cretin: Thanks for BUCY again---I have realy done well on that one.... three trades made a lot of money I think leeco did also
Treacherous_Cretin [14:59]: welcome rw
Treacherous_Cretin [14:59]: BUCY is a favorite of mine
rw [14:59]: have you by chance heard from Tradzer-------
Andrew [14:59]: out BP tiny loss
Treacherous_Cretin [14:59]: no. rw. I have not been online much lately
Andrew [15:00]: I'm very frustrated over not holding onto AVNR longer after I observed the market makers internalizing the buy orders near 3.72.
madriver [15:01]: have you seen knight lately
kotarah [15:01]: I have it
rw [15:01]: I made a lot of money when Tradze, you and Raymoney were here last year ----I sure hope Tradzer has not fallen prey to some dire fate. worried about him and Mrs. Tradzer
Treacherous_Cretin [15:01]: have seen nobody lately first day here in a while
Andrew [15:02]: He was here Friday and mentioned good things about SEED, FBP, FRE and FNM.
madriver [15:02]: talk about pessimistic....dire fate....like what?
rw [15:02]: Andrew has been a tremendous help to me TC.- since you left last year and have not been here - I have asked for Andrew's advice and help and he has been great. Thanks Andrew
rw [15:03]: also Andrew is prompt.........I do not get frusturated waiting for answers LOL
madriver [15:03]: everyone needs help sometimes
rw [15:03]: ok that is all for a while- chatting to much - will get called down......LOL
nester [15:03]: stopped out SOMX +6.8%
madriver [15:03]: give that man a price
kotarah [15:03]: NICE
madriver [15:03]: prize
Andrew [15:04]: out IFLG -1%
Andrew [15:04]: IFLG is going on my 'do not trade
Andrew [15:04]: 'do not trade' list
lindo [15:05]: It will be in mine too if I can ever get even on it
madriver [15:05]: that thing moves in mysterious ways....
madriver [15:05]: I've never seen anything like it.....
madriver [15:06]: obviously be screwed with by someone
rw [15:06]: faz 14.87
Andrew [15:06]: long IFLG 6.48 (triple position)
madriver [15:06]: do not trade....just left the building
rw [15:07]: faz out 14.87 comm lost
Andrew [15:08]: out IFLG -0.8%, I deserve that
Andrew [15:08]: It seemed like someone really wanted to manipulate it higher, lol
nester [15:08]: another meeting...
rw [15:08]: Andrew: I wonder what wiehg the banks have on FAZ and
rw [15:08]: fas
rw [15:09]: I have all the stocks in those two just not sure of the weight of insurance co, banks etc.....
rw [15:09]: I try to watach all the stocks in faz and get a break by watching bid vs ask - green and red
Andrew [15:10]: I'm not sure about the specific weights, but the big banks have the greatest weight.
Andrew [15:10]: GS, WFC, JPM, C, BAC are the biggest I think
rw [15:10]: Thanks Andrew
madriver [15:11]: My next dog's is going to be Rex!!!!
madriver [15:11]: name
carr [15:12]: Mine will be PEIX
Andrew [15:12]: back short IFLG 6.41 (triple position)
carr [15:13]: In fact I may change one of my two dog's names to that
Andrew [15:13]: The 'do not trade' goes into effect tomorrow so I can continue to revenge trade it this afternoon (not recommended).
ortrade [15:13]: Add to FAZ short 1400s@14.82p
madriver [15:14]: HERE PEIX....you neighbors will be like....what the heck
Andrew [15:14]: lol
carr [15:15]: I think I would pronounce it like Peeks
madriver [15:15]: I was thinking like Pex like pex tubing
carr [15:15]: LOL
carr [15:15]: pex sounds good too
Andrew [15:18]: added to IFLG short 6.41 (double position)
carr [15:18]: Madriver, my neighbors would be more like "what is wrong with that guy"
madriver [15:19]: that's what fences are for........best neighbor is a fence so they say
carr [15:19]: pex and rex could be siblings mad
Andrew [15:20]: Rex is latin for King
carr [15:20]: pex is latin for happy pills
madriver [15:20]: I think rex is related to pex
madriver [15:20]: in a bad way
carr [15:20]: my pex is a small dog so your rex needs to be a big dog
Andrew [15:21]: out half IFLG +2.5%
madriver [15:21]: Seriously would like to get a greyhound but I wouldn't call him Rex...deserves better
carr [15:22]: I admire anyone who is able to rescue a greyhound
madriver [15:22]: unfortunately they race them in WV then mistreat them once done racing....pretty sad.
carr [15:23]: very sad
Andrew [15:23]: added back to IFLG short 6.28
madriver [15:23]: They race them in Wheeling
carr [15:24]: WV is a beautiful state, but don't like greyhound racing. I lived in Florida and hated that they did it.
lindo [15:24]: I own a retired one. Used to have two. They are great dogs
carr [15:24]: Not the racing just the way the dogs are treated.
madriver [15:25]: I've never seen a race and fortunately don't live in WV but close enough to get one when I decide
carr [15:25]: You must be an animal lover lindo
lindo [15:25]: Treated by most owners as commodities. If they do well, they are taken care of
madriver [15:25]: lindo...they are petty gentle dogs
lindo [15:25]: They are extremely gentle.
madriver [15:25]: pretty
carr [15:26]: Yet many of them have every reason to hate humans, very telling
lindo [15:26]: You just can't let them out without a leash, which is a drag sometimes. They see something, they run for it and who knows where they go.
carr [15:27]: I have Cairn Terriers, same problem the chase instinct
madriver [15:27]: i have 2 mutts
Andrew [15:27]: added to IFLG short 6.33
lindo [15:27]: When I got mine, they were retired from the track, and so beat down that you hae to go very easy when you train them.
lindo [15:28]: mutts are some of the best dogs mad.
madriver [15:28]: lindo...have 3 acres all fenced in so I could let them rip?
carr [15:28]: A firm but gentle hand and lots of encouragement usually works best.
Andrew [15:28]: Today's volume might even be worse than Friday's.
lindo [15:29]: yes. They mostly have bad teeth from the rotted meat they feed them. Try to get them on a high protein diet at the track. Builds muscle
jolox [15:29]: Mad.........chat me
carr [15:29]: Andrew we are trying to talk about pets here, why do you keep talking business LOL just kidding
lindo [15:29]: lol
Andrew [15:29]: That's how exciting the market is this afternoon before Alcoa earnings.
Andrew [15:30]: out half IFLG +4.6%
Gar [15:30]: Good afternoon. I see the volume is horribly anemic ahead of the earnings season.
lindo [15:30]: My put was up 22.50, now down 12.50 for the day. Have to wait until after hours for earning report
Treacherous_Cretin [15:31]: yeah its bad Gar
lindo [15:31]: So bad we started talking about dogs, as in pets
Andrew [15:31]: Gar, how many years does the NYSE Volume in the top left take into account?
Gar [15:32]: By the way, for any trials here, if you haven't registered already, there is a free webinar tomorrow night that demonstrates StockVision basics. You don't need to be a trial user, everyone is welcome, but it will be geared to new people. Info at www.garsworld.com/webinars.htm
LEECO [15:32]: All wishy-washy-except for the Bear/Bull-I hope it is reliable for tomorrow.
Sandman [15:33]: Hi Gar, I know you said it before but someone asked about the NYSE Volume Change: I said I think it's an avg. oflast years volume. Am I right or wrong?
LEECO [15:33]: What time GAR
rw [15:33]: 8PM east cost time leeco
Gar [15:33]: The NYSE volume threshold is based on the last couple of years average. That standard is not dynamic, i.e. it does not adjust itself based on recent history. Although I may need to adjust it soon if this pathetic volume continues.
porti [15:33]: fastest signup ever!!!!
rw [15:34]: terrible day to trade -- down nine dollars
Hoecake [15:34]: Taking votes on AA earning, beat, miss or hit?
carr [15:34]: rw, down nine dollars? you are having a good day
carr [15:34]: way better than mine
Gar [15:35]: Hoecake, you mean will the roulette wheel come up red or black?
Hoecake [15:35]: Yep
Hoecake [15:35]: Just for fun
Gar [15:35]: You guys gotta realize that when the volume is this pathetic, trading is very very difficult.
lindo [15:35]: makes me feel better
Gar [15:36]: This free webinar for SV basics has been super popular. We max'd out on the webinar service in 4 hours. Had to actually upgrade the service to accomodate more people. Guess lots of people really want to learn more?
porti [15:36]: Thanks Gar, i asked about the volume change.... i just cant remember of seeing it green once
madriver [15:36]: I say beat but stock still get hit
carr [15:36]: Hoecake, you need to post more, you have a great sense of humor, and great insight
madriver [15:37]: I agree. Hoecake I demand you post more
rw [15:37]: just lost time carr -----got to impatient knew JCP and would go up but got tired of watching it so sold and lost comission.......also GLW
Hoecake [15:37]: LOL thanks carr, I feel like I don't have much to contribute so I keep my mouth shut lol...
Hoecake [15:37]: Thanks guys,
Hoecake [15:37]:
rw [15:37]: Hoecake: enjoy your posts
Gar [15:38]: porti, volume was green on last options expiration day I think.
carr [15:38]: Everyone with good ideas is very much valued
Hoecake [15:38]: rw, long time friend...thx..
Hoecake [15:38]: Well depending on my FAZ calls will determine how much I post LOL
Hoecake [15:38]: j/k
lindo [15:39]: I thought it was green early last Monday as well.
rko [15:39]: Hoecake: I think AA will show a loss -.03 per share, stock will soar on the news.
Gar [15:39]: What drives me nuts is the anemic volume "rallies." Violates lots of logic.
Hoecake [15:40]: Oh by the way on the pets thing, I might have the creepyist pet, I have a hairless cat named Henri
carr [15:40]: Hairless cats are really cool as long as they have personality
LEECO [15:40]: GAR-glad you weren't on when I vented this morning-it would have depressed you-I feel better now due to some info from SV poster/buddies
Hoecake [15:40]: I one vote for up, and one for down... anymore?
Gar [15:41]: AA will either go up, down, or sideways. I can guarantee that 100%.
Hoecake [15:41]: LOL good call Gar
lindo [15:41]: I'm saying down since I bought those puts this morning
carr [15:42]: I go with Gar, it is safe LOL
rw [15:42]: Colonel Leeco: Glad you are better --but get a quik handle on depression.........
rw [15:42]: Yes Gar is correct...
Gar [15:43]: Leeco, I didn't really see any "venting" per se. I know you have that huge pension hassle.
madriver [15:43]: I'm glad I could help you out Leeco!!!
Andrew [15:44]: added back to IFLG short 6.22
carr [15:44]: Leeco was not really venting, just talking about a challenge he came up agains, and the family came together and supported and offered some ideas.
Treacherous_Cretin [15:45]: seems like no bozo close one way or other
jlm1 [15:46]: No but belt buckle is back to the center
ortrade [15:46]: Exit FAZ +243p
Gar [15:47]: Leeco, what we needs is some fat cat to buy out Garsworld and then you will be sitting pretty.
ortrade [15:47]: FAZ 3000@14.71p
Gar [15:47]: Too early for bozo close. Those clowns don't make a move until the last possible minute.
ortrade [15:48]: The only rule FAZ obeyed today was the 14.73 resistance line.
carr [15:48]: hey forrestww would you please private chat me?
Andrew [15:49]: out 1/3rd IFLG +3.5%
madriver [15:49]: are you even with that are you still jacking around with it?
Gar [15:49]: If you put a gun to my head and made me preduct what AA will do after earnings, I would say it soars higher. Only reason I say that is this market is looking for an excuse to buy. I like to error on the side of what "excuse" the market is looking for.
rko [15:50]: I agree Gar
Andrew [15:50]: If this rally was in anticipation of good earnings then there could be some profit-taking before the close.
Gar [15:50]: Has almost nothing to do with earnings. It rarely does.
Treacherous_Cretin [15:50]: probably Gar. Too many dumbass bulls left wanting this to go up
rko [15:50]: Earnings will have nothing to do with the move
Treacherous_Cretin [15:51]: will take something bigger than AA to make them drop their pom-poms anyways
Gar [15:51]: Lol TC, you always have a way with words. But my sentiments exactly.
Gar [15:52]: Yeah wait til we get into the giant big cap has-beens, like IBM, MSFT, INTC, etc.
Treacherous_Cretin [15:52]: earnings will probably not be too dreadfull vs. expectations for the season
madriver [15:52]: rko is spot on about 99% of the time.....but only usually talks when Gar is here...what's up with that rjo?
fuseboxxx [15:53]: paper..VITA long 1.81
madriver [15:53]: earning will be good for AA.....beat the street
rko [15:53]: I work during the day
Treacherous_Cretin [15:53]: Euro and Asia will determine market direction
madriver [15:53]: oh...sorry rko....
Gar [15:53]: Someone sent me a chart over the weekend that blue my mind. A 1936-37 chart overlayed against the S&P since April. They are IDENTICAL.
Treacherous_Cretin [15:53]: Earnings may beat, but the quality will suck
madriver [15:53]: they make quality aluminium!!!!!lol
madriver [15:54]: stainless too I believe.lol
Treacherous_Cretin [15:54]: Everyone is hoarding cash. Not good
Treacherous_Cretin [15:54]: no bozos for close as I suspected
Gar [15:54]: I still think the most likely scenario is an AA spike-o-rama in after hours. However, it is possible it will decay and be red by the open.
Andrew [15:54]: IFLG wound up working out well, but I'm not sure if it was worth the risk.
madriver [15:55]: I can tell you someone not hoarding Cash!!!!
madriver [15:55]: you made your broker rich atleast
Gar [15:55]: I wish I was hoarding cash. My answer to that is, "What cash?"
madriver [15:56]: hoecake are you hoarding cash or did you ex take it all???
Treacherous_Cretin [15:56]: Part of me thinks no spike or dive. I think most expectations might already be priced in and there isn't really anywhere to go
Treacherous_Cretin [15:57]: market starting to feel kind of lost
rko [15:57]: knight has all the cash
Andrew [15:58]: Bulls win this one
madriver [15:58]: 100k easy money
madriver [15:58]: i feel sorry for all those that went head first into PEIX
Andrew [15:58]: Near 11:00am people had a chance to get scared but the selling stopped.
ortrade [15:59]: all I see today is casualties on both sides in this dead heat day..
Andrew [15:59]: out rest of IFLG +2.4%, out FAZ +0.2%
Gar [15:59]: Looks like bozos are buying, albeit light.
ortrade [15:59]: Exit FAZ +225$p
ortrade [16:00]: Total for the day - traded only FAZ -573$p
Andrew [16:00]: Worst volume day today since the end of April.
madriver [16:01]: expect it to continue
Gar [16:01]: TC I thought of that too (no spike). Only problem with that theory is the volume is soooo pathetic that I assume there are sideliners champing at the bit to do SOMETHING. That pent up bozo-ness is spike producing fodder.
jolox [16:01]: LOOK BOZ......PEIX IS IN BUCKET # 3
Andrew [16:01]: The last day we had such poor volume actually was 4/26 (the high of the rally).
lindo [16:02]: that's interesting
Andrew [16:02]: Actually more like 4/13.
Andrew [16:02]: 4/26 was even a little bit better than today.
Gar [16:02]: Trading tip: When the market volume is terrible, limit your trade choices to stocks trading above their normal volume. Because at least THOSE stocks are getting action.
Treacherous_Cretin [16:02]: dunno Gar. they must have been satisfied by the rally last week. I don't see how much of earnings season can be better than what is already priced in
ortrade [16:03]: There were sufficient number of weak hands on both sides today. In that case the market is set in a narrow range and weak hands are decimated one by one and the only perceived thing on indexes and etfs are some begining of patterns that end in limbo with a larger volatility. A good example is FAZ.
kotarah [16:04]: 50 MA??GAr
Andrew [16:04]: I was sitting in FAZ since 12:15pm and it wound up doing absolutely nothing.
Gar [16:04]: Maybe. I just think the anemic action means huge sidelining, so this "wait and see" stuff could blow up, one direction or another. Remember, "post earnings" is the mother of all bozo trading. Well, second to the Fed nonsense.
Treacherous_Cretin [16:04]: I had the thought after looking at the charts of last week which I was not here for and how everything went up on no volume for no reason that perhaps they have begun pricing in another round of stimulus
jolox [16:04]: Earnings for the most part will be good.....companies have cutback to the bone and are not hiring.
ortrade [16:05]: The only trading hope in a day like today is to stay away from etfs and pick stocks that trend (if you can - when market is stuck so are most stocks) Anyhow market may not do much till tomorrow after the treasury budget at 2pm
Gar [16:05]: kotarah, 50MA...? Not sure what you are asking.
kotarah [16:05]: GAR are you refering to Volume over 50 MA on any stock?
Gar [16:06]: What is "MA" (with respect to volume)?
kotarah [16:06]: Volume has MA is it 50 MA
Gar [16:06]: You mean volume moving average?
Andrew [16:06]: Lots of selling in the biotechs the last couple of hours. I should have been a little more patient with shorting them.
Gar [16:07]: The volume % change for stocks here is based on that stock's average volume for the last 30 days.
kotarah [16:07]: In volume on my charting It has 50 MA as a guide I have programed the 50 on volume
kotarah [16:08]: OK got thanks Why 30 MA
Gar [16:08]: I don't know anything about that. My earlier point on volume was that stocks trading above their norm are the ones to consider on low market volume days.
lindo [16:09]: Gar, do you have a suggestion as to what % above norm?
Gar [16:09]: Why 30? It's just an arbitrary place to measure. The needed number is to determine what the stock "normally" trades. That's the only purpose of it.
kotarah [16:09]: Im sorry for the confusion I understand you use 30 I have 50 MA on volume and base it wether it goes above 50
Andrew [16:10]: The 50-day average in volume?
madriver [16:10]: lindo...if you're long any percent will do
kotarah [16:10]: YES all my Volume
madriver [16:10]: I see what you're saying kotarah
Gar [16:11]: ANY percent above norm is good, because it means there is trading interest for that stock. However, here is a tidbit that I'll bet almost no SV user knows. There is a value in our lists here called "Exponential Volume." This is amount of CONSISTENT volume a stock is trading above or below. In other words, a stock trading above normal volume---if it is trading that all day long, that is far more significant than one birst of bozo volume.
madriver [16:11]: you have a 50 day volume indicator...sort of
kotarah [16:11]: I't a difference of number I just wanted to know why use a lower number than 50 ?
madriver [16:11]: along with the 50ma
kotarah [16:13]: I use EMA as well with 50 MA Is there a difference in using 30 verus 50 GAR?
kotarah [16:13]: Alcoa prelim $0.13 vs $0.12 Thomson Reuters consensus; revs $5.19 bln vs $5.05 bln Thomson Reuters consensus
Treacherous_Cretin [16:13]: CSX did okay with earns. AA has raised global consumption estimates but is still halted
kotarah [16:13]: JUST POSTED
Andrew [16:14]: Isn't using an EMA looking at 50 days kind of moving in the direction of just using a SMA looking at 30 days?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:14]: will probably shoot up
madriver [16:14]: not much of beat
madriver [16:14]: tc down right now
kotarah [16:15]: What I dont understand is why use the 30 insted of 50 MA on VOLUME ANDREW
madriver [16:15]: sorry I think I am wrong
Andrew [16:15]: Still halted it looks like
kotarah [16:15]: Alcoa beats by $0.01, beats on revs; raises aluminum consumption estimate (10.87 -0.07)Reports Q2 (Jun) earnings of $0.13 per share, $0.01 better than the Thomson Reuters consensus of $0.12; revenues rose 22.2% year/year to $5.19 bln vs the $5.05 bln consensus. "The top and bottom line growth was driven by higher volumes from stronger end markets and continued gains from our productivity programs. Based on this improved end-market demand, we are raising our projection for aluminum consumption from 10 percent to 12 percent this year."
Andrew [16:15]: What's magical about 2.5 months vs. 1.5 months. They're both pretty arbitrary right?
kotarah [16:16]: I though there may be a difference maybe I didnt explain properly
Andrew [16:16]: 30 is probably more relevant to short-term trading and 50 slightly longer-term.
kotarah [16:17]: I'll change it on charts and see if that is better
Andrew [16:17]: I would imagine the results would be pretty similar.
madriver [16:19]: simple or ema?
kotarah [16:19]: I will see I like to understand why the two numbers if there the same I have always used 50 MA on Volume I would like to try out the 30 MA and see EMA
Andrew [16:19]: I've never actually heard of graphing the MA for volume before.
madriver [16:20]: what plat are you using kot
Gar [16:20]: I think AA is halted?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:21]: yeah has been halted since close
kotarah [16:21]: Well you have now I have bullets for any stock that is trading above the 50 MA (EMA) thats how I know whats moving with volume
kotarah [16:22]: I posted the earnings report on AA
Treacherous_Cretin [16:22]: I chart volume moving averages andrew
lindo [16:22]: how do you do that TC?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:22]: helps see better when consistent volumes is surging into stock
Andrew [16:22]: What do you use it for TC?
kotarah [16:22]: Thank TC I thought I was alone
Treacherous_Cretin [16:22]: let me check
kotarah [16:22]: spike in Volume ANDREW
Andrew [16:23]: Have you found that the amount of volume bounces off the moving average?
Andrew [16:23]: like price sometimes does
kotarah [16:23]: any stock that crosses up through the 50 MA will go off alerting me that volume has passed the 50 MA
Treacherous_Cretin [16:24]: It is just an indicator you can choose among those in quotetracker
Treacherous_Cretin [16:24]: I use the 50 EMA
forrestww [16:24]: hello everyone see you in the webinar
jolox [16:24]: VMA......http://www.marketvolume.com/analysis/volume_ma.asp
Treacherous_Cretin [16:24]: longer priod you use the more smooth the line
kotarah [16:24]: I have been using it as well
lindo [16:24]: I've got the volume on the bottom, but my MAs move with the stock bars
Treacherous_Cretin [16:25]: is nothing more than a horizontal line across your vertical volume bars
Treacherous_Cretin [16:25]: you using quote tracker lindo?
lindo [16:25]: yes
Andrew [16:25]: Oh cool. I guess that's a lot more precise than just eyeballing.
kotarah [16:25]: yes they all do LINDO however I have a system that tells you once it crosses up through the 50MA
LEECO [16:25]: Nite all -Bear/Bull has readjusted to almost neutral-ie: non-trend
Treacherous_Cretin [16:26]: right click on a chart
Treacherous_Cretin [16:26]: choose view indicators
Andrew [16:26]: Have a good afternoon.
Treacherous_Cretin [16:26]: browse the lower indicators
Andrew [16:26]: Thx guys for the info on volume MAs.
kotarah [16:26]: Hence GARS comment on the MA He hit home because it was a good point I just wondered about 30 MA
Treacherous_Cretin [16:26]: and choose the Volume + EMA
lindo [16:27]: I think I found it, or something similar.....yes Volume + EMA Thanks TC
Treacherous_Cretin [16:27]: just a visual aid for assessing volume.
lindo [16:27]: everthing, almost, helps
Treacherous_Cretin [16:27]: I always judge the reality of moves based on volume
kotarah [16:27]: We are on the same page TC except I have little lights that go off with alerts on Volume
Treacherous_Cretin [16:28]: A dummy like me needs the visual aid
kotarah [16:28]: that is good I use it alot
Treacherous_Cretin [16:28]: I don't have any volume alerts set
lindo [16:28]: dummy, I don't see dummy
Treacherous_Cretin [16:28]: not really a primary data for me
kotarah [16:28]: We are using two differnt programs but the same functions
Treacherous_Cretin [16:29]: I watch price volume action around pivot points mostly
kotarah [16:30]: I use only to see if a stock is moving on volume as an alert sometimes it catches alot of stocks moving fast before they realy take off
Treacherous_Cretin [16:30]: I tend to like slow and deliberate moves
kotarah [16:30]: I use pivots as well but volume spikes are very good
Treacherous_Cretin [16:31]: I watch what is going on with a stock around a pivot before the thing gets there and then judge the viability of a reversal there
Treacherous_Cretin [16:31]: based on overall market action and trends
lindo [16:32]: How to you know the pivots?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:32]: works for me. gnerally able to get in things with minimal chances of any loss and move stops above break even
lindo [16:32]: to = do
Treacherous_Cretin [16:32]: you can put them on your charts lindo
kotarah [16:33]: TC some stocks move against drops and go up based on some sort of news volume levels against the market work well
Treacherous_Cretin [16:33]: is an available upper indicator on your charts
Treacherous_Cretin [16:34]: be sure you get the daily pivot as well as all 4 support and resistance levels
kotarah [16:34]: YES
Treacherous_Cretin [16:34]: I track a few stocks that generally play well with their pivots regardless of the cause
lindo [16:35]: I see now. The only thing I new about pivots was how to calculate them manually. Too time consuming
kotarah [16:35]: my wach list and scans are to the left of my chart it tracks over 100 stocks in realtime and alerts me with parameters set
Treacherous_Cretin [16:35]: put 'em on your charts and look how often they bounce right off those suckers
lindo [16:36]: I'm doing it
lindo [16:36]: thanks
Treacherous_Cretin [16:36]: like RIMM today dropped down on the daily pivot of 52.41 and moved up
kotarah [16:36]: Your right there on parameters and have to pass all the rules
kotarah [16:37]: 50 / 20 /10 MA ECT ECT
kotarah [16:38]: For example VVUS pick up as a short at 0.18 down VVUS fell over $1
Treacherous_Cretin [16:38]: Is always nice when a price bumps up against a major moving average in conjunction with a pivot as well
Treacherous_Cretin [16:38]: That is just what I do
Treacherous_Cretin [16:39]: there are a million ways to trade
Treacherous_Cretin [16:39]: whatever you do has to be your own
kotarah [16:39]: I told you were on the same page
lindo [16:39]: thanks for the lesson
Treacherous_Cretin [16:39]: I believe the game is won by hitting singles
Treacherous_Cretin [16:40]: I rade low risk setups and take modest gains
lindo [16:40]: winning would be nice
kotarah [16:40]: Thers all sorts on different market days TC some like that some like homers as well some like both
Treacherous_Cretin [16:40]: you will seldom see me post anything like 8% or 10% gains on a trade
Treacherous_Cretin [16:41]: Homers are nice if the happen, but I never try for them
kotarah [16:41]: I only post a daily high
kotarah [16:41]: some of the as much as 30%
Treacherous_Cretin [16:41]: but you will see me post consitent small gains that compound my account nicely.
kotarah [16:42]: I see your posts and I do as well I am not KNIGHT
Treacherous_Cretin [16:42]: I raised the principle on my paper trading account by 30% in june
Treacherous_Cretin [16:42]: have one going for July now but have not been trading much because of how I have been feeling
jolox [16:42]: AA up as high as 11.40......LOOKS LIKE A GOOD SHORT FORMING
kotarah [16:42]: I try to be informative only to help what that person does is up to him
Treacherous_Cretin [16:42]: will have a crap month
kotarah [16:43]: yes
Treacherous_Cretin [16:43]: You probably don't want to short that
Treacherous_Cretin [16:43]: right away anyways
Treacherous_Cretin [16:44]: let the shorts get incinerated and all of the dumb bulls pile on
Treacherous_Cretin [16:44]: and see where this market is headed
kotarah [16:44]: ok TC got to run see you tomorrow nice chat
Treacherous_Cretin [16:44]: bye katorah
jolox [16:44]: Jumped...30-40 cents......most of steam out of it.....too many calls
madriver [16:46]: lindo...what is the volume indicator on your setup?
lindo [16:49]: Sorry, hold on
lindo [16:49]: I just changed it to the Volume EMA 50 is the default but thinking of changing it to 30
lindo [16:50]: Trying to figure out these pivot points. I normally don't keep 3 days open but doesn't show them on 1 day. At least I don't think so.
Treacherous_Cretin [16:51]: you need prior day's charts on there for them
Treacherous_Cretin [16:51]: you should have a few days of prior for references anyway
lindo [16:52]: Took me a while to figure that out. Just been using Strategy Desk for past days because it's so easy to change back and forth
Treacherous_Cretin [16:52]: Again with RIMM...it bounced off the pivot and climbed steadily and died at the previous day's high
Treacherous_Cretin [16:52]: those are things to look for
Treacherous_Cretin [16:52]: things stall and reverse places for reasons
Treacherous_Cretin [16:53]: part of your homework on a trade is determining where that is likely to happen
lindo [16:54]: Looking at RIMM to make sure I get it
Treacherous_Cretin [16:55]: gnerally I move my stops along on a trade to protect a profit
Treacherous_Cretin [16:55]: you will have to figure out how you want to manage yours
madriver [16:55]: rimm dropped on earnings then moved up if I remember right
lindo [16:55]: On Rimm, did it actually touch the pivot, or within .25?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:56]: I don't know what it has been doing, I missed last week
madriver [16:56]: I know it dropped about 5-6% on earnings but haven't watched sense to be honest
Treacherous_Cretin [16:56]: I always check the chart with and without the afterhours prices. That changes the pivots
lindo [16:56]: I mean, on a two day timeframe, today and Fridayt. That's what I have open now in QT
Treacherous_Cretin [16:57]: with the afterhours prices, it nailed the daily pivot
lindo [16:57]: OK, let me check that
madriver [16:57]: tc what was the date
Treacherous_Cretin [16:57]: anyways I always cinch stops along as a trade progresses
Treacherous_Cretin [16:57]: we are talking of RIMM's chart for today
madriver [16:58]: i
Treacherous_Cretin [16:58]: Usually things will rest and retrace along the way
madriver [16:58]: what time was that?
Treacherous_Cretin [16:58]: you will find that often things drop back to the midpoint between pivots
Treacherous_Cretin [16:59]: Rimm hit the pivot around 11:25 today
lindo [16:59]: TC, can't remember where the control is for afterhours on QT
madriver [16:59]: thx
Treacherous_Cretin [16:59]: so look for those kind of retracements
Treacherous_Cretin [16:59]: right click your chart and click viw
Treacherous_Cretin [17:00]: view
Treacherous_Cretin [17:00]: it is the last item in that box
lindo [17:00]: ok
Treacherous_Cretin [17:00]: I would typically move a stop up to a little below the mid point between pivots when a price reaches a new pivot
Treacherous_Cretin [17:01]: or use a moving average for a stop level
Treacherous_Cretin [17:01]: In any case, I try to always let trades end with a stop out.
madriver [17:01]: tc...do/did you swing trade or daytrade?
Treacherous_Cretin [17:02]: what we think a stock might or should do is often a bad measure
Treacherous_Cretin [17:02]: I only day trade
Treacherous_Cretin [17:02]: seldom hold anything overnight
Treacherous_Cretin [17:03]: Trying to get well enough to resume trading. Has not been going to well though
lindo [17:04]: Try as I might, RIMM for today approached the pivot on mine, but never touched it. Trying to figure out what I did wrong.
madriver [17:04]: TC if I might ask what age are you?
Treacherous_Cretin [17:05]: whoever is reading all this junk I type, just keep in mind that is just what I do.....you have to devise a system and a method that works for you. You can probably come up with something better than what I do without a lot of trouble. To be successful, your system and entries and exits have to be your own or you will fail. We all see charts differently
Treacherous_Cretin [17:05]: I am 42....have to go
Treacherous_Cretin [17:05]: be well
madriver [17:05]: what in life goes in a linear fashion...not too many things
lindo [17:06]: TC, chemicals is all it is.
madriver [17:06]: chemicals...what like weedkiller?
nester [17:40]: Greece in "Death Spiral;" Europe Still in Deep, Deep Trouble, Says Niall Ferguson
http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/greece-in-%22death-spiral%22-europe-still-in-deep-deep-trouble-says-niall-ferguson-518977.html?tickers=udn,uup,ero,fxe,spy,%5Eftse&sec=topStories&pos=9&asset=&ccode=
nester [17:47]: Some states have already slapped taxes on blueberries, illegal drugs and fur clothing. But as budget shortfalls grow, state legislators are looking for even more creative ways to earn revenue.
http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2010/news/1004/gallery.wacky_state_taxes/7.html
fwguyus [17:48]: SHORT GREECE...
fwguyus [17:48]: ACTUALLY SHORT THE EURO...
nester [17:48]: lol hey fw. haven't seen you for a while
fwguyus [17:53]: yea..doing very little trading past few days..
fwguyus [17:54]: more paper trading...
Andrew [17:54]: It's a good period not to trade as much.
nester [17:54]: yes. hard to trade this at times
nester [17:55]: should have followed Andrew all day. he seemed to do well today
Andrew [17:55]: Except I got destroyed from 9:30 until 9:45 shorting SOMX too soon.
nester [17:57]: i did well with that one... thought about buying a small position right at close. just have a feeling it will go nowhere or fall tomorrow
fwguyus [17:58]: andrew got quick loss trigger finger...thats why
Andrew [17:59]: Some trading software allows for hot-keys to enter your orders.
fwguyus [17:59]: we all need to learn from him..and i guarentee we can all make better trades..
Andrew [17:59]: Like Lightspeed
nester [17:59]: yes he does... i can't even look them up that fast
fwguyus [17:59]: yea that would be awesome...like real simple sell and buy or short
Andrew [18:00]: Like Shift + 1 will setup 1000 shares and then Shift + B will do market buy via ARCA, or however you choose to set it up.
nester [18:00]: and Ctrl C for "crap i didn't mean to buy that one"...
Andrew [18:03]: lol
nester [18:03]: FAZ is down 2% in afterhours...
Andrew [18:03]: The market seems to like the Alcoa earnings.
nester [18:08]: WASHINGTON (AP) -- Federal bank regulators have agreed to give the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. unlimited authority to investigate banks, clarifying the agency's power that was in question during the financial crisis.
The FDIC's board on Monday approved the agreement between the insurance agency and regulators at the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department. It clearly spells out the FDIC's authority to make special examinations of banks. It was approved 5-0.
Federal bank regulators were widely criticized during the financial crisis for failing to signal high-risk practices before the institutions failed.
The FDIC, which takes over failed banks, has said it lacked access to needed information to evaluate banks' risk.
DJalecC [19:45]: I just watched BP fix the oil pipe live ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETctfVmq_8s :-)
Andrew [19:45]: Cool
DJalecC [19:46]: better than eastenders that was! lol
Andrew [19:47]: lol
Andrew [19:47]: Do you watch that?
DJalecC [19:49]: I was watching the live CNN feed here... http://edition.cnn.com/video/flashLive/live.html?stream=3
DJalecC [19:51]: look at after hours price rocket! ;-)
Andrew [19:52]: Yeah, it made it all the way back up to its 50-day moving avg.
Andrew [19:52]: Good stuff.
Hoecake [20:11]: I think I will be getting stopped out of my faz calls
Hoecake [20:11]: tomorrow
madriver [20:26]: good to see that well capped.....atleast it appears not to be leaking anyway
Hoecake [20:26]: Yes I saw that as well
Hoecake [20:26]: Its about time
madriver [20:27]: wonder if they shut it off or if they are pumping up to vessels above....
madriver [20:28]: I read the other day that approximately 50% of the oil that has come out of that well has evaporated......wonder how true that is....still a giant diseaster
Hoecake [20:32]: This is a horrible disaster
Hoecake [20:34]: When I was young I remember the exxon valdez spill, and now my son will remember this spill, its kinda funny how history repeats itself
madriver [20:35]: you're right!
madriver [20:44]: no stranger...that is scary
madriver [20:46]: hoecake ....what do you do for a "living"
Hoecake [20:46]: I manage a pet related business
madriver [20:47]: you travel don't you?
JayBird [20:48]: Someone bought 2,729,000 shares of AA @ 11.25 at 17:45 this evening. Wow
Hoecake [20:48]: Sometimes, I mainly go between Tucson and Phoenix
madriver [20:48]: that was probably knight
Hoecake [20:48]: lol @ mad
madriver [20:49]: dangerous but should of bought on earnings.......that one has moved up nicely
madriver [20:50]: could possibly be rw but not sure he has that much cake!
Hoecake [20:50]: i'm curious to see the options action on aa tomorrow
madriver [20:51]: I can never really figure out commodity stocks that well
Hoecake [20:52]: no me neither, I dont play them because I cant understand them and their movements,
madriver [20:53]: kinda of a hedge on inflation I suppose but inflation seems non existent so we are told by helicopter Ben........
Hoecake [20:56]: just curious mad, where do you see the market in 30 days or 3 months for now? Are you a double dipper lol?
madriver [21:05]: I don't think earnings are going to make much difference. I think the wildcard right now is the EU...seems very vulnerable in my opinion. 30 days around 200 higher than we are now 3 months I'm guessing about the same. Not an expert but I don't see any real catayst to drive this market in either direction except for EU. I certainly don't like what's going on with all the Federal spending.....they better get a better handle on that.....
madriver [21:06]: alot of chop in other words IMO
madriver [21:06]: how about you?
madriver [21:09]: I don't think unemployment is going to get much better soon. You know China has had a real runup in real estate which sounds crazy but that one is iffy but they have alot of cash so they can probably handle it. Whatever goes up that fast must come down I think.
Hoecake [21:09]: I have to say I agree with you. I do not believe earnings will be a catalyst in either direction. I do think though that without any catalyst in the near future we will guide lower. Lack of a reason to go up, will cause us to slowly drift lower. EU is kind of like the cloud hanging over, will it poor on us or fade away. The value of the dollar I think can be a big catalyst as well.
Hoecake [21:10]: Which is part of the EU issue as well. Unemployment will not get better anytime soon which will impact bottom lines on spending.
madriver [21:11]: agree..I know we are much more cautious than we were with our money
Hoecake [21:12]: I think without anything massive to send us upward, we will return to the downward trend and earnings are not enough to make a final shift in either direction
madriver [21:12]: your ex probably took all yours so you don't have to worry about that.....jk
Hoecake [21:13]: lol been slowly saving.... pulling money out before I can spend it
madriver [21:13]: we're probably all pretty much in the same boat
madriver [21:14]: know any rich chics?
madriver [21:14]: that is what you need to fund your trading account!!!!!
Hoecake [21:14]: My faz calls might not do to well this week, but I believe they will turn around
Hoecake [21:14]: lol
Hoecake [21:14]:
Hoecake [21:15]: Like Deuce Bigalow
madriver [21:15]: That is the first I've heard that term......
Hoecake [21:15]: Watch the movie.....
madriver [21:16]: does your ex work?
madriver [21:17]: if she doesn't you're screwed otherwise should be okay
Hoecake [21:17]: yes at the same place I do, just in a different department. Its ok though we do not have any issues, we just grew apart. There is no anger
madriver [21:17]: I hear other guys talk about this stuff so I know a little about this
Hoecake [21:17]: You married?
madriver [21:18]: hoecake....if you two can put that aside that is great for your kid and your sanity.....high regards for that
madriver [21:18]: Yeap and have a 4.5 year old.
Hoecake [21:19]: Yea, there is nothing to say we might not get back together, but for now we need our time apart. We have been together since 5th grade pretty much.
Hoecake [21:19]: Well congrats I have a 9 year old
madriver [21:19]: Need a break...can understand that......time will
madriver [21:20]: yeah I remember you saying you have a boy and the fact you guys kinda still get along is HUGE for him I would think
Hoecake [21:21]: Yes it is, I was over there last weekend swimming and had dinner, again there is no beef, just need a break.... its really weird. I think it would be easiyer if one of us had done something to the other, had a reason to be angry, but we don't so I think thats why this is not big issue.
Hoecake [21:22]: Just need space, need to grow, need to find ourselves and figure out what we as individuals want....its crazy
madriver [21:22]: I know what you mean however but sounds like what you have is best for your boy
madriver [21:23]: I can't even imagine not seeing my daughter everyday....mind blowing to me and hope I never experience it
madriver [21:23]: until she gets older and tells me to take a hike after I pay for college.......
Hoecake [21:23]: Its a change, good and bad, we rotate weekly, every Wednesday..
madriver [21:24]: sounds like a good situation there....you can date tooo.....that's awesome
Hoecake [21:24]: yes its a change for me.
madriver [21:25]: talk later hoecake.
Hoecake [21:26]: Laters
iswing64 [21:55]: Hey picker..tracking your trade on 60 min on/off...you hangin in there buddy?
picker304 [22:33]: Hey swing yea I really think the market is going to move north with maybe a couple of fakes along the way what you think?
picker304 [22:40]: Hey teach me to make 250% on faz with cheap OTM options you lucky dog? lol.. Great job cuz.
picker304 [22:42]: Hey Mad I'm there, don't see my daughter but once or twice a month. Yea it sucks man!
picker304 [22:45]: hey swing I don't like to watch it on 60 She looks bad real bad. I usually use daily and allow myself 7 days for exit. D's are colliding and d+ won't bust through for now. Starting to worry. However short macd is crossing long Oh and forgot the most important part ...pray alot
iswing64 [22:47]: My best guess for a longer term bull run onthe dow weekly..would have to see a few things happen with your fave indicators...psar...dmi..aroon...Daily looks like it would take some hard core work for the trend to resume...it could happen but i'm still mostly on the sidelines.. except for just a few 15 faz call....if we gap up tues...will be interesting if it holds through the rest of the week!!
picker304 [22:49]: Hey swing
iswing64 [22:49]: hey bud.. how ya doing?
picker304 [22:49]: ok how you?
iswing64 [22:50]: Great...love options!!
picker304 [22:50]: I bet after your faz win LOL
picker304 [22:51]: cuzs should split earnings
iswing64 [22:51]: lol well....yes that was fun
picker304 [22:51]: Hope we get a gap up Tues or Weds. i should be able to get out of CSCO with about 35+
picker304 [22:52]: It reached 19+ but I just couldn't hit the button
iswing64 [22:52]: Oh sweet picker...keep up the good work...
picker304 [22:53]: No not too sweet cause buying small so commission eats away
picker304 [22:53]: Still learning not going to invest much
iswing64 [22:54]: Hey buyin small is the way to go man...
picker304 [22:54]: Yea but you have to make 250% like you to break even i'm not that good yet LOL
iswing64 [22:54]: why risk more than you want...
iswing64 [22:55]: when your ready you will know cuz
picker304 [22:55]: guess so friend
picker304 [22:55]: Man your OTM must of craweled out a big hole to get that return that was great cuz
iswing64 [22:56]: It will happen for you pick...i know it..
picker304 [22:57]: You just yankin my chain now lol
picker304 [22:57]: Hey much nicer on here of late wouldn't you agree
iswing64 [22:57]: Ah...just nailed a tripple top on faz 60 min..pick..and helped drive it down
iswing64 [22:58]: No chain yankin with you cuz
picker304 [22:58]: do you ever play neutral delta stuff
iswing64 [22:58]: your in the trenches with us..
iswing64 [23:00]: No mostly still directional... but i do like that strategy....as long as you have enough cash to keep it going
picker304 [23:00]: LOL thats just it going and going and going ........
iswing64 [23:00]: It can be a good source of income if you know what your doing
iswing64 [23:01]: YEP!
picker304 [23:01]: Leaves me out
iswing64 [23:01]: How's your delta score??
picker304 [23:01]: double and triple tops are probably the best play out there
iswing64 [23:01]: Inside joke
picker304 [23:01]: As RW says you gotta start with 90 lol
iswing64 [23:02]: @!#$%^&*(
iswing64 [23:02]: Pardon me
picker304 [23:03]: lol.................Everytime I find tops they have already been proven and ready to consolidate again
picker304 [23:03]: Man I do love tos for options you should try it so transparent
iswing64 [23:04]: lol know what ya mean...it's like you gotta be right on it
iswing64 [23:04]: Yes i will sometime pick
picker304 [23:05]: Man I do love options though Wish I would of tried them years ago
picker304 [23:05]: Mine are usuaklly setup for 7-10 days so I wonder if we should even post them. I haven't been much
iswing64 [23:05]: Funny..istarted with options... kinda backwards
iswing64 [23:06]: Why not?? I'd like to see them...i'm sure others would too.
picker304 [23:06]: Well then cuz your butt better be helping me if I need help. I'm too proud to say I have alot to learn
picker304 [23:07]: meant not to proud
picker304 [23:07]: If anyone can help me make money let me be the first to thank them LOL
iswing64 [23:08]: LOL pick...i don't know everything but if you need an ear i'll be around cuz
picker304 [23:09]: But one thing I have learned is not to listen to anyone about chart setups or market direction. Its a feeling thing your feelings if you know what I mean. I could of made thousands on FNM in 2008 but oh no I listened to everyone else followed the crowd. I'm still pissewd about that one
iswing64 [23:11]: There was an old saying i heard from my commodity option days...."I'll know it when i see it and if i;m wrong i'll get it next time"
iswing64 [23:12]: lol
iswing64 [23:12]: Not as many charts back then...lol
picker304 [23:12]: Love it and don't have no one to blame but myself
iswing64 [23:15]: Cuz you will be fine...when your heart stops pounding and your head stops spinning and your palms stop sweating.. and you stop shaking....your a vet...
picker304 [23:15]: I believe the market will rise my feelings my business but no one should believe anything I say and definitely don't follow lol
picker304 [23:15]: Yea got so into promotong bout forgot how to read a chart but I'm comin back
iswing64 [23:17]: Hey...don't worry about posting what you think...or what you trade...posting kinda helps in a way... as far as making you think.
iswing64 [23:17]: Well for most traders i think...lol
picker304 [23:18]: But now this new thang called options starting all over.... I'm beginning to sound like you know who..........shut up picker
picker304 [23:18]: LOL
iswing64 [23:18]: LOL....
picker304 [23:18]: ? do you usually play deep ITM?
iswing64 [23:19]: NOOOO... I like the posters who have a reason....and explain it
iswing64 [23:19]: Right around it pick...just depends
iswing64 [23:20]: what i think and what i;m willing to pay
picker304 [23:21]: I have found that lower ext value gives you more playtime before decay sits in plus ITM has intial higer delta. Of course I also understand if you know a stock directional move and know its gonna move OTM are good because cheaper and more move for options sake
picker304 [23:21]: Am I close darn that was a mouth full
iswing64 [23:21]: Yes...you got it
picker304 [23:22]: I know theres alot of ways and thats why I love it.I think LOL
iswing64 [23:23]: Oh man you can make it so complex if you want too...
picker304 [23:23]: The reason I am focusing on dialy charts is I am presently thinking longer term but still haven't master time decay and may need to move to 60 minute and less time.
picker304 [23:25]: I have made 20+ 20+ 18+ and one expired worthless so I ok right now....Please understand those quotes are not bragging I've lost much more than I've made LOL
iswing64 [23:25]: well thats really the way to go for options...dailycharts...
iswing64 [23:25]: You bragg??lol
picker304 [23:26]: Tell you what when I never lose like you know who I'll brag
iswing64 [23:27]: Stick with your plan... cuz like i know you will...and always keep an eye on your 6.
iswing64 [23:27]: I lose pick...
iswing64 [23:28]: Just like everyone
picker304 [23:28]: Anyone who don't is trading in their dreams
picker304 [23:29]: or using the stars ..remember that one? lol
iswing64 [23:29]: But i'm back on the horsey the next day!!
Andrew [23:29]: I once had a big loser in my dreams. I woke up and was so glad I hadn't cancelled my stop. lol
iswing64 [23:29]: yes....goofy...lol
picker304 [23:29]: thats the key cuz. I'll quit trying when I run out of money
picker304 [23:29]: lol andrew
iswing64 [23:29]: lol
picker304 [23:30]: Andrew you got it bad ol buddy lol
fwguyus [23:30]: hey all
picker304 [23:31]: minis are up a little of course that means nothing at 11pm ... lol
picker304 [23:31]: hey fw
fwguyus [23:31]: question...for all the stock market gurus?
iswing64 [23:31]: Hey see you guys later...have a good one..
picker304 [23:31]: C ya swing thats cuz
fwguyus [23:31]: what really happens to a stock when a some one buys shares...
picker304 [23:32]: meant thanks
fwguyus [23:32]: or sells the shares..
picker304 [23:32]: it goes up and down LOL
fwguyus [23:32]: lol...yea i know that
picker304 [23:32]: did I win a prize
fwguyus [23:32]: but my question is...
fwguyus [23:33]: no not just yet picker?
picker304 [23:33]: I don't know tell me friend
Andrew [23:33]: I can give you a really detailed answer if you want fwguyus depending on who your broker is.
fwguyus [23:33]: ok..obviously...when you short a stock...the price will naturally come down..righht
fwguyus [23:33]: i trade with td and IB
picker304 [23:34]: Ok got that much
picker304 [23:34]: Hurry I wanna hear this and only got 15 mins
fwguyus [23:34]: now does the price of a stock come down as well tooo..when i make a sell the shares i previously bought
Andrew [23:35]: Ok here's what happens when submit a market buy order to TD Ameritrade...
fwguyus [23:35]: becuase..my sale will be replaced by someones sale...
Andrew [23:35]: Or market sell let's do...
fwguyus [23:35]: i mean somones purchase..
fwguyus [23:35]: so the only way a stock price can come down is by shorting it..right?
Andrew [23:36]: The broker's software will likely send your order over to a market making firm it is partners with. Most likely called Citadel.
fwguyus [23:36]: ok
Andrew [23:36]: The market making firm can then choose to directly take the other side of your trade and in exchange give you nominal price improvement.
fwguyus [23:36]: i m with you ....
picker304 [23:36]: its a bidding game
Andrew [23:37]: So Citadel can buy your shares from you at the current bid price + 0.001 or something tiny like that.
Andrew [23:37]: (Aside note: they then have a vested interest in the trade going against you)
fwguyus [23:37]: oh i c
Andrew [23:38]: Citadel could also just match your sell order with another retail buy order coming through TD or another broker it is partnered with.
picker304 [23:38]: Good point its an inside bidders game lol
fwguyus [23:38]: ok..i will ask it this way...
Andrew [23:39]: If they don't do either of those things Citadel or TD can post an order directly to an ECN that might pay them for receiving order flow from customers like you.
fwguyus [23:39]: 3 buyer say buy a stock for 1 .. and now the liquidity in that stock is 3..right
fwguyus [23:40]: one other person comes along and buys 1 more..which makes the stock worth 4...right
Andrew [23:40]: In the meantime a high frequency trading firm might have already sold/shorted shares at the bid price you saw so you might get filled at a worse price than you saw when clicking sell.
fwguyus [23:40]: from what you are telling me the odds are againt me.....
Andrew [23:41]: If you use IB and self-route your orders directly to ECNs you bypass your broker and market makers having access to your orders.
Andrew [23:41]: So you are then directly trading with the markets and theoretically have every advantage of professional traders.
fwguyus [23:42]: oh ok...
Andrew [23:42]: I don't understand your 3 buyer example though.
Andrew [23:42]: Here's the simplest case...
Andrew [23:43]: A stock has buyer who wants to buy 100,000 shares at 10.00 and a seller who wants to sell 100,000 shares at 10.01 and nobody else wants to buy/sell.
fwguyus [23:43]: i guess what i m saying is that ...the price of a stock is set by what ever the buyer are willing to pay for it...
fwguyus [23:44]: and just because a big order to sell that same stock..why does the price go back up to usally where it was...
Andrew [23:44]: In that case the bid price will be 10.00 and the ask price will be 10.01 but no transactions will ever be done unless either the seller becomes willing to sell some at 10.00 or the buyer is willing to pay 10.01.
Andrew [23:45]: Then all transactions will be done at either 10.00 or 10.01 and the stock will trade 100,000 shares without the price really moving at all.
fwguyus [23:45]: sorry guys..i really havent thought about what really wanted to ask...but i will put it down and ask again...later..
fwguyus [23:46]: your time is up pick...
picker304 [23:46]: keep in mind that mms also adjust prices fw
fwguyus [23:46]: really those sobs..
Andrew [23:46]: So whether the price moves depends on whether there is a seller/buyer imbalance, either a seller or a buyer who really wants in/out somewhat urgently so is willing to pay more to buy or get out for less. Then the price will move more.
picker304 [23:46]: fw I love your ? I'm still pondering on them
Andrew [23:47]: If you watch a Level 2 box you can see in action how the price actually moves.
fwguyus [23:47]: mee to..picker....just have to ask my questions more precisely..
picker304 [23:48]: Or maybe a dummy like me can't answer them LOL
fwguyus [23:48]: lol...i m sure its not that...
Andrew [23:48]: In short though it depends on how low sellers will accept selling for, how high buyers will accept buying at, and how much size the buyers and the sellers want to buy/sell.
fwguyus [23:48]: there is just a lot to learn in the market and seems like you never know enough...
Andrew [23:49]: There are always exactly the same number of shares bought and sold so in that sense prices don't move because there are ever more buyers than sellers or vice versa.
fwguyus [23:49]: ok..let me ask this one simple question..
picker304 [23:49]: Right fw thats why you just have to love it to do it. Its a never ending study guide but isn't it interseting?
fwguyus [23:49]: what would happen if there was no such thing as shorting?
Andrew [23:49]: Instead it has to do with how aggressively the buyers want to buy compared to how aggressively the sellers want to sell.
fwguyus [23:50]: yea..def...a life time of learning..
fwguyus [23:50]: i think thats what make me trade...cuse it never gets boring..
Andrew [23:50]: If there was no such thing as shorting then stock prices would be able to rise more easily since it would eliminate a source of selling.
picker304 [23:51]: Investor A would sell and Investor B would buy but investor A not shorting cause owned shares to start with
Andrew [23:51]: At the same time though it would be more difficult then for market makers to make money so they'd need to widen the spreads.
fwguyus [23:51]: but buyers would want to take profit at some time...which would bring the stock price down..
Andrew [23:51]: Since the market makers are the ones taking the opposite side of the dominant trend usually.
picker304 [23:51]: I hate spreads LOL
Andrew [23:51]: Yes but buyers already want to take a profit so that's no different.
fwguyus [23:52]: exactly my point...
Andrew [23:52]: If stocks were already moving down from buyers selling, however, they would then drop even faster without bouncing most likely since there wouldn't be shorts covering on the way down.
picker304 [23:52]: Its been great guys Cya tommorrow fw so great to talk to you again Cya Andrew
fwguyus [23:53]: night picker..
Andrew [23:53]: Good night picker.
Andrew [23:53]: Is that kind of what you mean or am I missing what you're really asking?
fwguyus [23:54]: no i think i got it...
fwguyus [23:54]: just still something in me is not 100 percent..
Andrew [23:54]: Some stocks wouldn't have up-moves that are explosive as well since there would be no shorts buying high when they're wrong.
fwguyus [23:54]: so i have to think about it..and i will aask you later..ok
Andrew [23:55]: Often the people willing to pay the highest prices are short sellers who were wrong and urgently need to get out fast to control their losses.
fwguyus [23:55]: yea but when an explosive move happens..the buyers who bought earlier..would bring it donw by taking profit...so...
fwguyus [23:55]: it would naturally come down..
Andrew [23:56]: Yes unless there were always new people willing to buy high if the company was very undervalued still for some reason.
fwguyus [23:56]: say a company issues 1m shares to be traded on the market...
fwguyus [23:56]: how much short stock is available to short..and who issues short stock..
Andrew [23:57]: Shorting a share stock = just borrowing the share of stock from someone who already bought it
Andrew [23:57]: So up to 1m shares could theoretically be shorted then too.
Andrew [23:58]: There is no such thing as a short stock so it isn't issued or anything like that.
fwguyus [23:58]: so out of those 1m total shares..say i bought 800 000 of that stock...
fwguyus [23:58]: which leave 200k left over which is still available to buy..
fwguyus [23:59]: now say you come along and say i want to short that same stock..are you able to only borrow 800k of that stock or 1m
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