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Forum date: 06-08-10
JayBird [2:29]: dow futures +83
PA [5:15]: FTSE is trending down http://freeserv.dukascopy.com/chart/?stock_id=345&stock_id=345&interval=60&points_number=100&view_type=candle&width=400&height=300&show_labels=true&osc_type=-1&rfi=false&height=300&p1=2&p2=3&p3=7&c=2161248&detach=true©r=true&refcode=466cf71a58031761231f924ff390c75df7e947d8336706aaf7d8d717d6dd67a3827a6d7b6e6b72387d7281
PA [5:17]: Dow future is now +16
nester [7:44]: LUXEMBOURG (AP) -- The European Union on Tuesday thrashed out ways to toughen oversight of how governments run their economies in a bid to regain credibility with markets and prevent a repeat of the debt crisis afflicting the region.
EU Economy Commissioner Olli Rehn said he expects finance ministers from the 27-nation bloc would move quickly to reinforce economic governance at a meeting in Luxembourg, a day after most agreed on more sanctions for countries with risky finances.
The euro has been roiled by the fallout from a debt crisis that started in Greece, one of the 16-nation currency's smallest economies, after it revealed that it had been lying over the state of its public finances.
The crisis has exposed weaknesses in the monetary union and led to massive market pressure on governments to show they can reduce spending, even as the economic recovery remains fragile. The austerity measures are provoking unrest and labor protests across the continent, with Spanish civil servants striking Tuesday over wage cuts.
nester [7:44]: GENEVA (AP) -- Switzerland's efforts to calm a banking furor hit a major setback Tuesday as nationalist and left-wing lawmakers blocked a treaty with the United States that would have allowed UBS to hand over thousands more files on its American clients to U.S. tax authorities.
The Swiss government and Washington had painstakingly crafted the treaty last August to resolve a long-standing dispute over the bank's alleged role in aiding tax evasion but 104 lawmakers in Switzerland's lower house voted against the deal Tuesday, compared to 76 in favor. Sixteen lawmakers abstained.
The government had urged lawmakers to approve the deal to avert harm to the Swiss economy, which is heavily dependent on the country's banking industry.
The deal is crucial to UBS -- the country's largest bank -- which has faced intense pressure from U.S. authorities since 2007.
nester [7:45]: NEW YORK (AP) -- Stocks are looking for direction Tuesday after another late-day plunge sent the Dow Jones industrial average to its lowest level in seven months. Stock futures rose slightly.
Sharp swings over the final hour of trading have become the norm in the market over the past month as investors remain concerned about what news might come out of Europe overnight about ongoing debt problems. The end-of-day moves are similar to the ones seen in late 2008 during the height of the credit crisis when investors feared holding onto stocks overnight.
Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke said late Monday that European leaders were taking the right steps to control rising deficits, but that wasn't enough to assuage concerned traders. Major European indexes fell again early Tuesday.
nester [7:46]: European stocks fell Tuesday, as investors worried that growth would be hurt by the region's sprawling debt crisis and spending cuts. Comments by Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, who indicated the U.S. recovery was on track, helped Asian indexes close higher, though the momentum was short-lived.
The UK's FTSE 100 was down 1.37 percent to 4,999.82 points, while Germany's DAX 20 dropped 1.36 percent 5,824.72 and France's CAC-40 lost 1.70 percent to 3,357.72. The euro fell to $1.908 against the U.S. dollar, near a four-year low.
European Union countries on Tuesday agreed on ways to toughen oversight of how governments run their economies in a bid to regain credibility with markets and prevent a repeat of the debt crisis afflicting the region.
nester [7:46]: LONDON (AP) -- Oil prices slid back to near $71 a barrel Tuesday as European investors looked beyond encouraging comments from U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke and worried about the impact of the debt crisis on demand.
Benchmark crude for July delivery was down 45 cents at $70.99 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange late morning European time. The contract lost 7 cents to settle at $71.44 on Monday.
Although major Asian stock markets rose modestly Tuesday after Bernanke said he's hopeful the world's No. 1 economy won't fall back into a "double dip" recession, European indexes failed to keep the momentum and were mostly lower.
Investors are worried that painful spending cuts to reduce debt will hurt economic demand -- including for oil -- in coming years.
A sliding euro, near recent four-year lows, also weighed on oil prices. The euro dipped to $1.1911 on Tuesday from $1.1916 on Monday, making crude more expensive for investors holding the European currency.
nester [7:46]: WASHINGTON (AP) -- Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke said Monday he is hopeful the economy will gain traction and not fall back into a "double dip" recession.
"My best guess is we will have a continued recovery, but it won't feel terrific," Bernanke said.
That's because economic growth won't be robust enough to quickly drive down the unemployment rate, now at 9.7 percent, he said in remarks to the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars, a nonpartisan research group.
The economy grew at a 3 percent pace in the first quarter of this year. That's good growth during normal times. But coming out of such a deep recession, the economy must grow much more strongly to make a dent in the jobless rate.
Fears have grown that the recovery could be derailed if Europe's debt crisis turns into a broader financial contagion, crimping lending in the United States and around the globe. The situation has spooked investors, sending Wall Street into fits of panic.
nester [7:47]: WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- Federal Reserve board chairman Ben Bernanke said Monday he didn't think that the U.S. economy would slip back in to recession, saying that consumer spending and business investment seem strong enough to keep the economy growing, albeit at a relatively subdued rate.
"My best guess is we'll have a continued recovery [but] it won't feel terrific," he said.
Fears of a double-dip recession have multiplied in recent weeks. The weak May employment report released Friday, which showed just 41,000 private-sector jobs were created last month, was only the latest signal that the U.S. economy may be softening again.
nester [7:49]: SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- Among the companies whose shares are expected to see active trade in Thursday's session are Bob Evans Farms, Steak 'n Shake and Dollar General Corp.
LEECO [8:11]: Good morning nester I think there's something wrong in your 7:46 post showing the Euro as $1.90?
nester [8:14]: Morning Leeco - could be. i get this information from the news lines and it is dated a bit. some are a few minutes behind and others are a few hours...
jim [8:17]: Morning Leeco, Nester
nester [8:18]: morning jim. did you do well yesterday?
jim [8:19]: Morning Nester I was gone most of the day and couldn't trade and am laying back a bit to see how this crazy market shacks out
madriver [8:19]: morning nester,jim,leeco
jim [8:20]: morning Mad
nester [8:20]: morning mad...
madriver [8:20]: looks like the EURO is up slightly?
LEECO [8:21]: Morning man and jim I have a dental appointment shall be leaving a little after 10
nester [8:21]: i know. been trying to hold off for 30 - 60 mins in to this market. hard for me to read sometimes
jim [8:22]: Right now I am looking at calls into October for several stocks
nester [8:22]: wow... you look out that far?
madriver [8:22]: I was just going to say that..
madriver [8:23]: that's got to be a tough read going out that far?
jim [8:24]: Not usually but right now I dont trust the daily movement
madriver [8:24]: jim..think the market is going to be up in Oct?
nester [8:24]: i'm still only buying June's options....
madriver [8:25]: a gamble and maybe a payoff could be BP or RIG going out to Oct?
madriver [8:26]: nester....is that a good or bad idea?
jim [8:28]: I have been looking at cvx, hero,
nester [8:28]: on BP? well, i think it will fall a bit more first. by Oct, could be up. to me, too much of a gamble. i really don't look out that far.
madriver [8:29]: yeah...some are saying the B word ...who knows.
madriver [8:29]: I'm not doing that I just wanted your opinion
nester [8:32]: well, if you forced me to make a decision on it, i would say it could be near $30 in Oct. it is trending down right now and this started back in late April.
jim [8:33]: BP is deep in worldwide assets therefore I dont think BK will occur but they are going to be exposed to 15-20B in costs related to the spill.
nester [8:34]: and don't forget more exposure to this government and the "new" rules to play in...
madriver [8:41]: Jim...I've heard in the 37B neighborhood.
madriver [8:43]: also if there stock goes low enough they could be taken out
jim [8:43]: Mad could be right but that may be a bit on the high side
madriver [8:43]: right...only guess work at this point...time will tell
jim [8:44]: agree with the buy out if it goes low enough but most likely they will start selling assets first
jim [8:45]: they have lost approx 50% of there corp value at this point if you look at just the stock value
madriver [8:47]: pretty daunting..no doubt
jim [8:50]: jaso watcher
nester [8:52]: ARMH could be a gap play this morning
LEECO [9:00]: note the bull/bear buckle way bearish-mor downside ???
jim [9:09]: gone for the day see ya
LEECO [9:10]: bye jim
nester [9:13]: this to me is starting to feel like a day to find gaps up and then short them.
rexw [9:17]: I am watching CVS and EAT two from yesterday that gaped down
knight [9:18]: good morning !
LEECO [9:20]: good morning Prof knight-missed your input yesterday
majour [9:20]: morning Knight
knight [9:20]: which one leeco !
madriver [9:20]: Knight is back in action!!
knight [9:21]: I like faz short as my horse today
madriver [9:22]: knight
knight [9:22]: hello majour - how you make these days ?
rexw [9:22]: Morning Dr. Knight
knight [9:23]: also short tza too - easy play
knight [9:23]: hi rexw
ortrade [9:23]: Good morning
madriver [9:23]: as a counter to PEIX I like LTUM.....race to the bottom!!! Both alternative energy plays
LEECO [9:23]: knight just missed your running commentary-i find it useful
rexw [9:24]: We are fortunate to have Dr. Knight here.
madriver [9:24]: I don't but that's my opinion
knight [9:24]: thanks rexw
LEECO [9:24]: rexw are you formerly rex
knight [9:24]: are u new here rexw ?
LEECO [9:25]: rexw are you formerly rex
rexw [9:25]: The facts speak for themselves Dr. Knight ------Just the Facts and the trades - anyone with some inteligence can go back in chat and see the money you make.
rexw [9:25]: I will change back to RW - meant to do that last night.
madriver [9:25]: rw...come on
rw [9:25]: r
knight [9:26]: you are right rexw
madriver [9:26]: there you are!!
knight [9:26]: i have stop posting my real profit because - some folks on this board are jealous
madriver [9:27]: come on knight......
Iswing64 [9:27]: LOL
karenbcz [9:27]: knight - you've noticed that!!
Iswing64 [9:27]: PUKE
rw [9:27]: Frankly - with the negatives you receive Dr. Knight - I am surprised you post anything........However many of us appreciate it.
madriver [9:27]: I need to see that cash!!!
karenbcz [9:28]: Knight - jealousy ... I've found that to be a problem on most stock message boards. Sad isn't it?
rw [9:28]: Yes it is karenbcz
karenbcz [9:28]: Knight- this is truly a ZERO-SUM game.
madriver [9:29]: karen of all people speaking up!!!!
knight [9:29]: i don't really care about them , i am a positive man that's why i am successful in all my business
ortrade [9:29]: Looking at the indexes now, $DJI hit the historical low of the year on 2/8/2010. That is definitely dangerous as positive statements started coming in also given the Thursday announcements are coming.. The critical time for market action (breakouts/breakdowns) is the tele at 11.40am.
Iswing64 [9:29]: Also pumping..bragging chest beating...etc..
madriver [9:30]: knight...if anyone doesn't want to see your post they will block it...bottom line....don't worry about it. You are a bit over the top.....IMO
LEECO [9:31]: Come on now people be nice-no nasty remarks-juest contribute to help us make some $
madriver [9:31]: I'm being nice LEECO
rw [9:31]: GAR has said he does not want any PERSONAL ATTACKS any
Iswing64 [9:31]: I know why picker left..
madriver [9:32]: I don't see anything personal attacks....yet.lol
madriver [9:32]: lswing.....why?
madriver [9:32]: he didn't like me or knight?
knight [9:33]: this will work only with respect --- and i see only some person who are trying to backslash the other - i think they should be remove from here sooner or later....
knight [9:34]: add seed on weakness 8,6
madriver [9:35]: Knight...you can ignore people what's the big deal
Iswing64 [9:35]: Had nothing to do with you madd..
knight [9:36]: i have no time to loose with those comments - thanks
rw [9:36]: cvs doing well as I said earlier
madriver [9:38]: picker was great...I hope he returns someday. I don't know him personally however he seemed pretty cool. Helped GAR out alot it seemed
madriver [9:39]: Knight do you not like me?
Iswing64 [9:39]: He wont but let's get on with our day
madriver [9:40]: okay....I agree
Mckoan [9:42]: Gold & Silver stocks are climbing this morning. Gold made an all time high in overnight trading.
karenbcz [9:45]: L FAZ 17.04
nester [9:46]: FAZ 17.11
madriver [9:47]: Karenbcz.....you comment about being jealous......we've done everything to support you in here....that comment is complete nonsense
nester [9:53]: Mckoan - did you figure out the spike on metals yesterday?
Mckoan [9:55]: No...jusy the general stuff like the EURO and Hungary's problem. I held on to my core position.
LEECO [9:56]: SV has Basic Materials as thew top sector but coal is lagging?
nester [9:56]: read this yesterday... Two weeks ago in NIA's article, 'Don't Doubt Bernanke's Ability to Create Inflation' we said, "Precious metals will decouple from the Dow Jones and we will begin to see gold and silver rise at the same time as the stock market falls." The decoupling NIA predicted is clearly taking place right now.
madriver [9:56]: Nester..try your hand at TZA
nester [9:56]: mad - will look at it. thx
PA [9:58]: Hi every body Long TZA 500*8.2796
majour [9:58]: short DELL 12.82
nester [10:05]: out FAZ even
Hank [10:15]: morning all, FAZ17.34
ortrade [10:18]: morning Hank
Hank [10:19]: morning ortrade,
Hank [10:20]: FAZ 17.34/17.54 = .20
ortrade [10:21]: I see lots of directed volatility now looking at SLW and NGD but dont trust shorting them yet..
majour [10:21]: short BRKR
majour [10:21]: 11.95
nester [10:25]: FAZ $17 calls $1.66
ortrade [10:26]: NGD 200s@6.43$
majour [10:29]: ortrade, I'm watching NGD it looks good
karenbcz [10:32]: Nester: what r u showing the high was on FAZ so far today?
karenbcz [10:32]: MY ToS chart sez 17.60 .. I know that's wrong.
rw [10:32]: 17,60
Willie2 [10:33]: 17.60
nester [10:33]: well, i'm looking for $18 thinkin it will bump into the 200ma then fall back
nester [10:35]: sorry... read your question wrong... lol
Hank [10:39]: FAZ 17.55
Hank [10:41]: FAX 17.55/17.74= .20
rw [10:41]: WELCOME new trials -------New People Here. Any questions - we are glad to answer them Most answers are in "tutorials" be sure and look over the entire system including traps - glad you are here........
Hank [10:41]: sorry .19 cents.
ortrade [10:45]: SLW 200s@19.00$
knight [10:47]: add faz short 17,94
knight [10:48]: add tza 8,49 short
Hank [10:48]: X 40.28 short
knight [10:50]: add seed 8,18
ortrade [10:51]: Exit SLW -15$
knight [10:52]: now only wait to grab the easy money from the shell again
knight [10:53]: always the same path from MM
knight [10:54]: the market will turn green
ortrade [10:55]: Exit SLW -25$. Total -42$ for the day made big trading mistake.. when FAZ goes up donot short basic material like gold/silver
nester [10:55]: out FAZ calls +16%
ortrade [10:55]: darn NGD drops now..
Hank [10:55]: nester good move
nester [10:56]: out ERX puts +15%
nester [10:56]: thx...
knight [10:57]: rdn 7,82
majour [10:58]: NGD 6.49
knight [10:59]: i will be careful with gold - the profit is already gone....
nester [10:59]: if FAZ closes above $18, then we definitely are trending down on the Financials. price should stay around there to allow the 10ma to move and cross the 200ma. start of the "kiss of death" to them
madriver [11:01]: BP is getting hammered again today
nester [11:03]: hello Gecko - are you new to our group?
knight [11:05]: we know that the economy is on a slow recovery - so stock market will very slow mo too....and painfull too
Hank [11:06]: FAZ looks like a 50,00 dollar stock. wont that be nice.
knight [11:07]: but patience will pay
Hank [11:07]: lol
karenbcz [11:07]: Hank: I agree. Have core holding which I will NOT trade or sell.
Hank [11:09]: Looks like the shorts are driving home, I see another 2 wk vacation coming up soon . lol
majour [11:10]: out NGD no gain no loss
ortrade [11:10]: FAZ 100@17.97$pe
PA [11:11]: OUT TZA 8.54 +$ 110.15
ortrade [11:13]: very andgry with myself exited NGD and SLW thinking that if FAZ rallies so does gold that is not so watch now NGD and SLW.. nasty..
knight [11:13]: gold is always nasty
knight [11:14]: add tza short 8,6
broberts [11:15]: gm all
ortrade [11:16]: since I expect direct correlation of gold short with faz likely I will avoid trading it as a morning contrarian short..
broberts [11:16]: FYI- Can't say much but FYI- Keep a sharp eye out for FTR. Good news is looming
knight [11:18]: shorty expect a shorty rally , i don't think that will happen - the market will go green...
knight [11:18]: add seed 8,13
bkcincy [11:19]: $TRIN = .65
broberts [11:19]: No hype at all. Been on here to long and have never ever tried to make a stock run. But FTR looks good. The $10 call is where I'll be putting some money at the minimum
broberts [11:20]: excuse me $10 call EOY
bkcincy [11:20]: fas
ortrade [11:20]: Add to FAZ 100@17.85$pe
knight [11:20]: the dow is now green and will continue
broberts [11:21]: I own MHS and it took off yesterday...Still seeing if it will stick
ortrade [11:22]: Tons of directed volatility big red bars reversing with beg green bars like in SLW and NGD..
broberts [11:22]: 1000 srs FTR $7.64
ortrade [11:22]: ADD FAZ 100@17.63$pe
bkcincy [11:22]: $TRIN = .59
knight [11:23]: MM play to control the direction to full the pocket
knight [11:24]: rdn , seed are making a nice come back
ortrade [11:24]: looks to me today the target is to ruin the hedge funds, regular morning retracements were replaced with giant volatility both way.. nasty that indicates maybe traders are all ruined.. lol..
nester [11:25]: FAZ $17 put $1.13
knight [11:25]: easy to follow - easy money to grab
ortrade [11:25]: Exit all FAZ -117$pe
knight [11:26]: we might have a rally up too with bargain hunter and shorty covering
ortrade [11:26]: FAZ 300@17.53$pe
broberts [11:26]: advancers over decliners leaping up a lil
ortrade [11:28]: just watch this giant volatility and nasty reversals on FAZ..
broberts [11:28]: 2000srs LNG @2.80
ortrade [11:28]: ADD FAZ 200@17.63$pe
rw [11:28]: WELCOME new Trials: Any Questions ? Be sure and go through the "tutorials"
nester [11:28]: FAZ between $17.10 and $18 most of the day. good plays both directions
knight [11:28]: i find it a great opp to make $$$ this volatility
rw [11:29]: Glad you are back Broberts
Hank [11:29]: Novice Traders sell into support and Buy at resistance.
newbie [11:29]: Everything following EURO
broberts [11:30]: LNG looking for a nice bounce when/if market bounces
ortrade [11:30]: Good way to make money now is pick axle chop a tree make paper and print a dollar on it..
Hank [11:31]: ortrade, If you need a silent partner we are all in. and tea an biscuts on me. lol
knight [11:31]: market will bounce - no douth
knight [11:32]: time to find cheap stock oversold....
ortrade [11:32]: Hank we should definitely turns.. lol..
knight [11:33]: i like FBP
broberts [11:34]: c ya gang...gotta start trading a little more dilligently, bounce is here
knight [11:35]: peix should bounce too
knight [11:36]: FAZ, TZA are great short
ortrade [11:37]: Add FAZ 200@17.43$pe using simple CCI 14 for signals.. as I believe market is in sideways as vol on FAZ subsides.. the trouble the period 14 is rather arbitrary..
ortrade [11:41]: AA FAZ 200@17.42@pe
Squid [11:41]: x
karenbcz [11:43]: reload FAZ @ 17.46
nester [11:43]: short ERX 26.83
nester [11:50]: out ERX -1%
PA [11:53]: Long ERX 27.24
PA [11:56]: BRENT 73.94
LEECO [11:57]: Back from dentist-you all can cal me numblip
PA [11:58]: http://freeserv.dukascopy.com/chart/?stock_id=505&stock_id=505&interval=60&points_number=100&view_type=candle&width=400&height=300&show_labels=true&osc_type=-1&rfi=false&height=300&p1=2&p2=3&p3=7&c=2223942&detach=true©r=true&refcode=466cf71a58031761231f924ff390c75df7e947d8336706aaf7d8d717d6dd67a3827a6d7b6e6b72387d7281
ortrade [12:00]: The reason I am still holding FAZ now is that the volume on the FAZ dtn is going down..
knight [12:04]: faz is going down like a rock
knight [12:04]: and will continue back to 15 range
karenbcz [12:05]: good! I'll load up.
rw [12:05]: Better to buy at 15 karen, not now.
nester [12:12]: out FAZ puts +5%
nester [12:14]: FAZ $17 calls $1.49
LEECO [12:15]: nester did you buy FAZ calls at 1214?
nester [12:16]: no. a bit earlier. got tied up so i didn't post at the right time
nester [12:17]: short ERX 26.79
nester [12:19]: this market looks and feels like yesterday to me. FAZ between $17 and $18 most of the day i think
LEECO [12:19]: nester are there charts or streaming quotes to be had for options
nester [12:20]: streaming quotes on my broker...
LEECO [12:21]: which brtoker-e-trade says they don't have them
PA [12:21]: Hi nester are you playing with real money or paper trade.
nester [12:21]: ameritrade
nester [12:21]: real...
nester [12:22]: i always start out with "papertrade" before the ticker if it isn't real
Willie2 [12:22]: Leeco hit "option chain" button on upper tool bar in etrade pro
PA [12:23]: I just bought 200*27.24 may have to cut loss if you are right.
PA [12:24]: ERX
Iswing64 [12:24]: Add to FAZ @ 17.49
nester [12:24]: oh... hopefully we both are, but i see it falling back down to at least $26 then heading to $24
LEECO [12:24]: nester-I hit option chain button & got the chain-it seemsstatic-how often does it update?
nester [12:26]: Leeco - on mine, you select the option that you wish then select buy. that opens up the streamer portion. but again, that is ameritrade
ortrade [12:26]: Exit FAZ -50$pe
ortrade [12:27]: FAZ 900s@17.47$pe
LEECO [12:27]: woops just saw a last trade update on QQQQ options but I don't see what strike price it was for
Willie2 [12:28]: Leeco be sure you use the "link" button to ling option chain to watch list and chart screens
PA [12:29]: ERX Chart still looking good to me it is within the boundary of my Bollinger Band. OBV is good only MACD are a little weak, relative strength with DJIA is good.(5mins.)
nester [12:31]: PA - did u purchase the stock? or options?
PA [12:32]: I purchase stock
nester [12:35]: out ERX short -0.9% out FAZ calls +5%
PA [12:37]: Nester you get in and out quite fast, are you using pay per shares broker
nester [12:37]: no. per trade
PA [12:38]: I am using Ameritrade now.
LEECO [12:38]: Nester-I telephined e-trade & a rep walked me thu how to get option streaming charts
LEECO [12:40]: Faz 17 June calls now 1.58
nester [12:40]: paper them first Leeco. get to understand how they work. also, try not to pick tickers that have large spreads in the bid/ask
nester [12:40]: 1.53/1.55 now
ortrade [12:41]: Exit FAZ +76$pe
LEECO [12:41]: I will paper them -do you get more spread out of same month calls (ie: June now) or better with July or later/
ortrade [12:42]: FAZ 400@17.31$pe
nester [12:42]: the spreads should be close to the same. just don't go into one that has a 20 or 30 cent spread in it. like ERX has. tough to get in and out at times...
nester [12:43]: i don't even look at July until next week. try to stay within a 5 week period
PA [12:44]: Hi Leeco you go to Market Dept ( if you are using Etrade Pro) and use the find symbol (magnifying glass) to get a symbol
PA [12:44]: option symbol
ortrade [12:45]: add FAZ 400@14.37$pe
ortrade [12:46]: These are all CCI trades
LEECO [12:49]: This is neat I have faz june 17's with a streaming chart that shows me that at 11:13 the calls were $1.99 & @11:57 $ 1.39 & now $1.52
LEECO [12:50]: Thanks PA-but when I click mag glass I get the symbol asFAZ-by the way are you from Pennsy
ortrade [12:51]: ADD FAZ 200@17.22@pe
PA [12:55]: Leeco on find symbol You change the type to option enter symbol and press find, then you can choose all strike price otherwise it just show you close to the money contract.
PA [12:57]: Leeco No I am in Thailand PA is my initial. I was trained in U.S.A. though Long time back
ortrade [12:57]: correction to 12.51 post ADD FAZ 400@17.22pe
LEECO [12:59]: My son was in Thailand (oodapah base I think) during Vietnam war
nester [12:59]: PA - love Thailand. was there 2 years ago. wife and i talking about going back again this year
PA [12:59]: Hope he like Thailand
PA [13:00]: Glad to here nester
PA [13:00]: hear
LEECO [13:00]: He is an instrument & controls engineer now working at Dupont plant in Richmond, Va.
LEECO [13:08]: The numbness from the dentist is wearing off -I will go eat somethin now!
PA [13:08]: I am surprised there are many older people doing day trading, before I joy this web I thought there are all young people trying to outwit each other.
PA [13:09]: I am also a retiree.
nester [13:10]: short ERX 26.92
ortrade [13:12]: vol on FAZ should turn.. otherwise keep scarping this CCI 14 all day.. nasty..
ortrade [13:14]: Exit FAZ 400 +35$pe
LEECO [13:17]: PA-I am a muliple retiree-USAF(WWII), Quantum-acompany I founded, and Soc Sec.
LEECO [13:18]: Also 90 years old
PA [13:19]: nester you probably right I am out of ERX 200*26.6801 -$ 132.06 hope you make money on this stocks.
nester [13:20]: ERX is showing a lot of weakness. it tried to hit that high again. just can't do it...
ortrade [13:21]: Exit FAZ 400 +30$pe
PA [13:22]: Leeco you sound very healthy for your age if you mean your age. I have to go now it is 12.30 AM my time now talk with you later Leeco and Nester
DJalecC [13:24]: hey guys :-) hows it been ?
ortrade [13:26]: Interestingly there has been an overextended region in CCI where most of gains are.. just need to wait for the 5 min close below extremum lines
ortrade [13:27]: Exit last FAZ 400 +47$pe
ortrade [13:28]: FAZ 400s@17.44$pe
ortrade [13:30]: AA to FAZ 400@17.46$pe
ortrade [13:31]: meant ADD to FAZ 400s@17.46pe
DJalecC [13:31]: quiet then LOL... Cuba was hot hot hot, almost to hot! come back to TZA up up up (+9%) LOL nice! :-)))
ortrade [13:33]: Exit FAZ -170$pe
ortrade [13:33]: FAZ 800@17.62$pe
ortrade [13:34]: Add to FAZ 400@17.75$pe
ortrade [13:39]: plan to exit half position if FAZ hits 17.94
nester [13:45]: out ERX short +2.9%
ortrade [13:48]: I believe FAZ will utn from here with good entries on pullbacks from 10MA
Iswing64 [13:49]: Good job nester..may be a good time for some DIS puts..lol
nester [13:52]: haven't even looked at DIS for a while. been sticking with TXT, FAZ and ERX lately
nester [13:53]: swing - think FAZ will break the $18 area and hold?
ortrade [13:54]: Nasdaq is at daily low now.
Andrew [13:54]: long FAS 19.64
Iswing64 [13:57]: Well i'm leaning that way nester..prices are staying within upper bband range and no signs of slowing..to me anyway 60 min trend.
Andrew [13:57]: tripled up on FAS 19.67
DJalecC [13:58]: :-( no one talking to me... is it because I got a tan! LOL ????
Andrew [13:58]: Hi DJalec, just got on. How are you doing today?
nester [13:58]: hey DJ
nester [13:59]: swing - the 200 ma is about $18.02. thinking it hits that a few times before breaking it
DJalecC [13:59]: :-) Just back from Cuba... very relaxed :-)
Andrew [13:59]: Do they have a lot of wireless internet in Cuba?
nester [13:59]: pretty women there...
Andrew [14:00]: out 2/3rds FAS +1%
DJalecC [14:00]: they have zero wireless there... in fact it was a zero internet week!
Iswing64 [14:00]: On bbands nester..60min chart watching the "fence line" between 9 ema and upper band line
DJalecC [14:00]: Very nice women, shame I'm married and took my wife!
Andrew [14:00]: lol
nester [14:01]: yeah, they frown on that. never understood that...
Andrew [14:01]: out rest of FAS +1.1%
Andrew [14:01]: long FAZ 17.63
DJalecC [14:02]: but held TZA while away, up 9%, sweet :-)
Andrew [14:02]: Good hold.
Andrew [14:04]: My plan is to add to FAZ as long as it remains above the low 17.40s or so.
DJalecC [14:06]: dow is so low 9826, the crash is still on-going then
ortrade [14:06]: Same plan posted at 1.48pm.. lol..
ortrade [14:07]: right now FAZ faces some volatility as traders get used to this idea..
Andrew [14:09]: tripled up on FAZ 17.70
ortrade [14:14]: somehow I am not convinced the indexes will probe a lower low without a fight..
Andrew [14:15]: I agree ortrade. There have been strong buyers down near here, though originally on 5/25 their resolve wasn't really tested.
Andrew [14:15]: There hasn't been much strong in the market though the last few days.
Andrew [14:17]: out 2/3rds FAZ tiny gain
ortrade [14:17]: Andrew we are at the historical 2/08/2010 on DJI (posted 9.22am) hence the resistance
Andrew [14:18]: The financials look like they could go either way at this point from this consolidation.
ortrade [14:18]: Also vol on FAZ is leveling but not subsiding yet..
Andrew [14:19]: I never even look at the bear triple ETF volume since a lot can just be due to hedging from huge buyers that day.
Andrew [14:20]: added to FAZ 17.53
Andrew [14:21]: added to FAZ 17.52
ortrade [14:21]: I tested it as I mentioned yesterday.. vol increase on FAZ more than often implies utn.
Andrew [14:22]: added to FAZ 17.43
Andrew [14:24]: added to FAZ 17.40
Andrew [14:25]: added to FAZ 17.33
Andrew [14:27]: If there aren't sellers near here, that doesn't bode well for the bears.
ortrade [14:27]: almost -500$pe underwater on FAZ now..
rw [14:28]: when tick is green and increasing I would not buy faz long
Andrew [14:28]: I thought the chances of the financials being bought all the way up to here weren't too high.
ortrade [14:29]: FAZ on 5 min is at bottom of trendline, it should go up now..
Andrew [14:30]: But if there are more buyers in the market that could be a good opportunity too because it could potentially lead to a large short squeeze in the last hour.
Andrew [14:30]: Or this could just be a fake-out move before the sellers return and hammer the market down again.
knight [14:32]: faz is falling like a rock in the deep sea again - it's a fun game
knight [14:33]: look and see what i said this morning - this time it's done by trader
knight [14:33]: very easy money
nester [14:33]: its been bouncing just like i mentioned earlier. would expect another coming up soon
knight [14:34]: the rally is looking to start MM want it after all
ortrade [14:34]: it has benn bouncing of the daily open till now
knight [14:35]: faz target 15
knight [14:38]: let enjoy the ride to 15 and make $$$
knight [14:39]: i hope karen took position this time in the right direction
ortrade [14:39]: Exit FAZ -624$pe
Andrew [14:39]: I would like to be able to work out of this FAZ at a smaller loss, bu the market isn't really helping.
ortrade [14:39]: FAZ 1200s@17.22$pe
nester [14:40]: don't see $15 on FAZ do see about $15.80 or so. just don't think that they will drive it that far south this time
knight [14:41]: may be more than 15
nester [14:41]: either way, short from $18 that is decent...
knight [14:41]: they try to push the market after the big drop ...
knight [14:42]: RDN has a lot of power up
nester [14:43]: FAZ has been stuck between $17.10 and $18 today. don't think it will get over $18 and hold. the 200ma will push it down, besides, the 10ma is a bit too far away from the current price
knight [14:43]: better to sell before too late
nester [14:44]: should have bought a few puts on that high in the 17.90's
ortrade [14:45]: The historical DJI level I mentioned earlier is acting up..
nester [14:45]: knight - i'm clear of FAZ right now.
knight [14:47]: i am full short over faz since 17,95 with a clear target 15
nester [14:49]: i love this market. they are just ranging now.
knight [14:49]: same with TZA
DJalecC [14:49]: OUT TZA +8.51%
Andrew [14:49]: Something's happening with DISH and TIVO.
Andrew [14:49]: short TIVO 7.96
nester [14:49]: short ERX $27.06
majour [14:50]: Knight Thanks for the warning about gold
nester [14:50]: FAZ 17.20
Andrew [14:50]: added to TIVO short 7.92
DJalecC [14:51]: whats happening with gold ? heading south ?
knight [14:52]: not time to buy, the profit is already gone
DJalecC [14:52]: ok
DJalecC [14:52]: thanks was looking the other day.
nester [14:52]: silver looks to be a better purchase
knight [14:54]: wow a real yoyo market -- MM don't know where to go !
DJalecC [14:54]: aerg bouncing
Andrew [14:55]: out 2/3rds FAZ -1.1%
nester [14:55]: FAZ bounced right at the 17.10 area again. riding up to 17.70
knight [14:56]: don't think so nester
nester [14:56]: if it does, i'm shorting it back down with you
knight [14:57]: are u in ?
nester [14:57]: yes. 17.20
knight [14:57]: hiii iiii very iiiii
Andrew [14:58]: added to FAZ 17.32
nester [14:58]: it has been a mirror of ERX lately. when ERX turns south, FAZ has turned north
rw [14:59]: i got in at 17.33 while ago...small amount
rw [14:59]: Not sure I did not do what Dr. Knight did...., (hitting fingers with stapler and ruler)
nester [14:59]: rw - you long?
Andrew [15:00]: out FAZ tiny loss
Andrew [15:01]: long FAS 20.16
Andrew [15:02]: tripled up on FAS 20.19
Andrew [15:02]: out TIVO -0.5%
Andrew [15:02]: added ot FAS 20.25 (double position)
knight [15:02]: good choice andrew
Andrew [15:03]: There are a lot of shorts out there who could be inclined to cover unless the sellers really emerge soon.
knight [15:04]: FAS 20,25 too
LEECO [15:05]: DJ taking your wife to CUBA islikew taking your own sand to the beach LOL
DJalecC [15:06]: LOL I'll tell her!!!
rw [15:06]: Leeco- Surprised at you.......
RideHigh [15:07]: Hi what's going on here?
knight [15:07]: are u still in FAZ nester ?
rw [15:07]: YES Mr. Nester - I was got out aboot even
nester [15:07]: yes, still in FAZ long
rw [15:07]: Welcome RideHigh
DJalecC [15:08]: she says your cheeky Leeco!! :-)
Andrew [15:08]: Right now the market is deciding whether ot not to break out of its steep downtrend the last couple of days.
RideHigh [15:08]: What do you do here? Just play FAZ and FAS?
rw [15:08]: Are you new trial RIDEHIGH?
RideHigh [15:09]: yes
LEECO [15:09]: Mywife says I can look but not touch
rw [15:09]: NO. but we do right now...........look at tutorials - to see the opportunities please.
Andrew [15:09]: I only do FAZ/FAS when the overall market volume is very high and the market volatility is very high.
nester [15:09]: welcom RideHide. no, it is ranging and you can make good profits up / down on it lately
Andrew [15:10]: In those conditions most stocks move along with the market. Otherwise, you are usually better off finding an individual stock making its own move on its own news.
rw [15:10]: look at "what works" RIDEHIGH
RideHigh [15:11]: What stocks are FAS and FAZ?
rw [15:11]: 3X FINANCIALS ETF LONG OTHER IS 3X SHORT FINANICALS
knight [15:11]: finance bull and bear
Andrew [15:12]: They represent trading the financial sector overall. The financial etf is XLF. FAS moves about 3x as fast as XLF does. FAZ is the 3x inverse one.
LEECO [15:12]: see tutorials about ETF's
RideHigh [15:12]: That's dangerous.
knight [15:12]: it's perverted stock
Andrew [15:12]: They can be very difficult to trade in my opinion though unless you have practiced a ton.
Andrew [15:12]: In sideways markets they can be horrible to trade too.
Andrew [15:13]: You need a lot of things to line up in order to consider trading them.
DJalecC [15:13]: yep, sideways = sucks
Andrew [15:14]: Like a high probability of an overall trending market that day, decent volume in the market, the VIX high enough that the market movement could create a very large winning trade for you, etc.
carr [15:14]: DJ are you on your other computer or still dealing with your identity crisis:-)
carr [15:15]: DJ I hope you had a fantastic vacation.
Andrew [15:17]: added to FAS 20.04
DJalecC [15:17]: at home/office computer at the moment carr, relaxing with a big fat cuban cigar, it was sweet there thanks Carr, highly recommended visit :-)
majour [15:18]: looks like NESTER is winning with FAZ
Andrew [15:19]: out 1/3rd FAZ tiny gain
nester [15:19]: yeah, doing ok with it today...
Andrew [15:19]: FAS I mean
Andrew [15:20]: added to FAS 20.15
LEECO [15:20]: paper trade 10 contract FAZ june 17's @ 3:14 for $1.48
Andrew [15:21]: This is about where there should be a decent up-move if we have a chance for a short squeeze into the close.
Gar [15:22]: Good afternoon. This is looking like a carbon copy of yesterday.
LEECO [15:22]: sell @ $1.55 3:21 pe on paper make $70 less commissions
Andrew [15:23]: Nasdaq still can't get positive.
rw [15:23]: Hello Gar: RIDEHI is here ------on trial
Andrew [15:24]: Hi Gar. What are you thoughts about the last half hour?
Gar [15:24]: I don't see any RIDEHI
Gar [15:24]: My best guess is to go with the current market's form, which is to get pounded into the close.
LEECO [15:24]: paper bought 10 contract FAS 20 @ 3:15 for $1.55
rw [15:25]: RideHigh was here 15:12post
Gar [15:25]: In fact, I am looking at +47 Dow can't understand for the life of me who would be buying.
Gar [15:25]: Or why
LEECO [15:26]: sell paper fas calls @ $1.68
Andrew [15:26]: I guess not going down anymore is the new up.
nester [15:26]: what is FAZ at right now? mine has moved in quite some time
Gar [15:26]: Any kind of strength will be too tempting for holders to sell into.
Andrew [15:26]: Bigger volume than yesterday too so far.
moejd [15:27]: smae with TZA on Ameritrade
LEECO [15:27]: make(on paper) $139 less commiss)= 8 %
Andrew [15:27]: 17.10 / 17.11
Gar [15:27]: Dow still moving higher. What could the possible mindset be to buy into this?
Andrew [15:27]: and dropping
Andrew [15:28]: out 1/5th FAS +1.5%
nester [15:28]: amertrade is stuck. showing 17.29/17.30
Hoecake [15:28]: faz @ 17.16
Andrew [15:28]: I think it's just shorts covering since we held a higher low and broke out of our steep downtrend channel since Friday.
LEECO [15:28]: GAR -when trading calls like FAS are we better to buy in the money or below it
nester [15:29]: could be my computer. video card seized or something...
rko [15:29]: Ameritrade stuck for me too
nester [15:29]: now that sucks...
moejd [15:29]: Yes stuck even on my iphone
Andrew [15:30]: FAZ back close to 17
Gar [15:30]: leeco, I like buying as close to the money as possible. But if you have to error, error on the side of being slightly ABOVE so the trade is cheaper.
Andrew [15:30]: and dropping fast
nester [15:30]: on yahoo now watching. but i can't get out if i wanted
knight [15:30]: exactly the way i say faz down, market up fas up
Gar [15:30]: What kind of b/s is this "rally?"
Andrew [15:30]: Short squeeze
rko [15:31]: It is the bozo bus, screaming "all aboard"
rw [15:31]: You are right Dr. Knight good to short it close to 18dollars - Karen is going to get burned on this now....she was long at over 17 and will hold till = who knows when
knight [15:32]: is the nasdaq will turn green ?
Andrew [15:32]: That's the only thing troubling me knight.
Andrew [15:32]: out another 1/5th FAS +2.5%
knight [15:32]: that's her problem ...
rko [15:32]: Maybe the market decided to de-couple itself from the EURO
Gar [15:34]: QID could be a decent bouncer going into the close.
Andrew [15:34]: The bears really need to hold here or else we could close the day maybe +150.
Gar [15:34]: because Tech has been weak all day, and QID (reverse NASDAQ) has fallen pretty far in this bogus rally.
knight [15:34]: she is doing what she want after all.
Gar [15:35]: If we close +150 that has "lunar short" in neon.
Andrew [15:35]: Yeah
Gar [15:35]: I can't imagine anything more stupid than the market spiking like that into the close.
Andrew [15:35]: The same buyers who were there on 5/25 still seem to like those levels today.
Andrew [15:35]: At least for a short-term trade.
Andrew [15:36]: Their resolve still has never been tested yet.
Gar [15:37]: Remember, yesterday it appeared as a sideways close...until the final 2 or 3 minutes.
Andrew [15:37]: Yeah, maybe that will mean the sellers will want the prices to surge now so will ease up and then they can dump in the last 5 minutes or something.
knight [15:37]: look as faz is going in the deep sea again....
Gar [15:37]: This is starting to set up as a textbook lunar short.
Andrew [15:38]: out another 1/5th FAS +3.5%
Hoecake [15:38]: I might have to get some calls on FAZ this is a little overdone IMO
rw [15:39]: Hoecake - just as info. ---dr. Knight said FAZ will go to 15dollars - he is short faz close to 18
Hoecake [15:39]: thanks for the heads up rw...
Hoecake [15:40]: he is one of great knowledge...i will not bet against him
rw [15:40]: I wish I had went with him when he posted that.
Andrew [15:40]: I'm going to step away for a little while so I won't be tempted to sell the rest too soon.
knight [15:40]: wow nasdaq will be green over all...
Gar [15:40]: Awesome lunar short setup in CPNO.
Gar [15:40]: If it holds.
Hoecake [15:40]: note to self, faz near $15.00 = buy calls
Gar [15:40]: When did knight get his PhD rw?
knight [15:41]: yes FAZ short and FAS 20,05,20,10, 20,15, 20,20 and 20,25
rw [15:41]: Probably Harvard or Yale
LEECO [15:41]: SO-if I had held those FAS calls ubntill now I could sell @ $2.00 & make $ 450 in 25 minutes or 29% Long live option-Thanx GAR, Nester,RW and PA
knight [15:43]: business GAR
madriver [15:43]: the key word is probably
nester [15:43]: ERX is going to be my lunar if it keeps running up
Gar [15:43]: This is unbelievable nonsense. But a storybook lunar if it keeps going.
LEECO [15:43]: FAZ now16.78
knight [15:44]: will hold FAZ & FAS
Hoecake [15:44]: Maybe buy some cheap puts on FAZ
nester [15:44]: ameritrade still stuck.
Gar [15:45]: Hoecake, wait for it to go down in flames of seller glory, then buy calls.
Hoecake [15:45]: Thats I am debating, play the long or short side... i know FAZ will return back up
Gar [15:45]: Remember the rule: (1) Wait for the market to do something stupid (like now, for instance), (2) Wait a little longer, (3) then go the other way.
knight [15:45]: i did talk about a possible rally this morning in this red sea - you remember...
LEECO [15:46]: I notice that eventho FAS is 3x ETF and swings wildly-the option is slower giving more time to reactt
knight [15:46]: 2 reasons - shorty covering and bargain hunter....
madriver [15:47]: so what knight people make calls all the time....50% chance of being right
Gar [15:47]: Or sellers don't have anything else to sell.
LEECO [15:47]: I wrote it down when you posted it knight
knight [15:47]: yes no more sellers also
madriver [15:47]: there are suckers born everyday
Gar [15:48]: Hmmm...I still think this "strength? will attract new sellers late.
madriver [15:48]: PEIX is doing well....................NOT
Gar [15:49]: QID (long) could be an excellent lunar short as well if we spike up in the last minute.
Andrew [15:49]: We could still go a lot higher in 10 minutes.
Gar [15:49]: I don't know andrew, I think there could be a hammer coming. But that's a crap shoot call.
Andrew [15:50]: I think too many shorts got trapped by the apparent double-top mod-day.
Andrew [15:50]: mid-day
Mckoan [15:50]: The market must be looking ahead and predicting the Chicago Blackhawks will win the NFL. Only reason for the market to be advancing....Ha.
Gar [15:51]: There is probably a single fat fund who has some bogus "oversold" flag and he's buying his picks. It could be that simple...as we all second guess.
madriver [15:51]: Chicago Bears?
madriver [15:51]: blackhawks might of switched sports for all I know
Andrew [15:52]: All it takes are a couple of determined large buyers to hold a price level and then the fuel of the shorts and the momentum traders will take care of the rest.
Andrew [15:52]: We're in a momentum-driven market at the moment.
madriver [15:53]: isn't it typically momentum driven to a large extent
Gar [15:53]: Anything could happen in the next 7 minutes, but if this isn't a lunar short setup, I don't know what is.
madriver [15:53]: i think we go lower but...........
Andrew [15:54]: It wasn't really too momentum driven in the fall of 2009. Buyers and sellers were pretty patient to wait for better prices in both directions and the volume was low.
madriver [15:54]: you have a point
Andrew [15:55]: Over the several weeks buyers/sellers have been more concerned with getting in now or getting out now, and a lot more people are shorting now, adding further to the momentum.
Andrew [15:55]: last several weeks
Andrew [15:55]: out another 1/5th FAZ +4.5%
Gar [15:55]: An awful lot of this has to be huge shorts exiting late.
nester [15:57]: papertrade lunar short ERX 27.60 ameritrade still hosed up so i have paper only now...
madriver [15:57]: tech has gotten beaten up lately it seems
Gar [15:57]: Sideways close? None of us predicting THAT.
Andrew [15:59]: out rest of FAS +5%
Mckoan [15:59]: Long SDS 35.85
Andrew [15:59]: This is weird with so much Nasdaq divergence.
madriver [15:59]: it closed a little towards the close.....
Andrew [16:01]: Big volume today, but less than the buying down here on 5/21 and 5/25.
Gar [16:03]: Outside fo short covering, I still don't know who in their right mind would be diving in head first (long) on this spike up.
Andrew [16:04]: It could mostly just be short covering after a large dip buyer held this afternoon.
Andrew [16:05]: Maybe it's some fund managers deep in the hole who are averaging down. I'm not really sure how it works.
Gar [16:06]: Maybe it's what was said earlier, that "not going down" is the new "up."
Andrew [16:08]: It's still not too impressive to be up +123 after selling off -440 the past 2 days. It's less than a 30% retracement.
Andrew [16:09]: Nasdaq couldn't even fully undo yesterday's selling, let alone Friday's.
Andrew [16:10]: Have a good afternoon.
fwguyus [17:27]: hey ortrade
fwguyus [18:44]: hey andrew
Andrew [18:59]: Hey, fwguyus, how are you today?
fwguyus [18:59]: good..and u
fwguyus [18:59]: i havent traded for the past couple days
Andrew [19:00]: Yeah me too.
fwguyus [19:00]: but seems like market is taking a nose dive
Andrew [19:00]: I've only been doing light trading this week.
fwguyus [19:00]: i m stuck on a Sprint trade....
fwguyus [19:01]: hoping it will pick up by the end of this week..
Andrew [19:02]: It looks like it wants to go down and touch that trendline in the high 4.30s, but it finished better today along with the market.
Andrew [19:02]: I'd be careful with it long though until it starts holding above 4.75 again.
fwguyus [19:03]: i made a mistake by holding on to on the 2nd
Andrew [19:04]: It's still above its 50-day moving avg. though.
fwguyus [19:04]: i though it would pull up like it did last time when the 10 dipped below the 50..but it didnt..
fwguyus [19:05]: oh well..i will just have to hold on to it for a while...and do nothing until i m at profit...
fwguyus [19:05]: at least i wont be at a loss..then...
Andrew [19:05]: It still could be okay but I'd feel better if it got back above the 20-day moving avg.
Andrew [19:06]: What's your line-in-the-sand stop loss in it?
fwguyus [19:06]: i m sure it will in a couple of days..i have 5000 shares at 5.04
fwguyus [19:06]: major mess up..
fwguyus [19:06]: but i m not worried too much..i can wait it out..
Andrew [19:07]: It previously had problems in the 4.40s in Apri before it broke through in May. Previous resistance often becomes future support.
fwguyus [19:08]: i dont expect to start heading up...until the 10ema gets to about 4.45 area...
Andrew [19:09]: What % of your acct. do you have in it?
fwguyus [19:09]: 70%
fwguyus [19:09]: i just felt so confiden that i was going to make a new high..when it hit 5.30...
fwguyus [19:10]: i was going to get ridof it at the new high.....
fwguyus [19:10]: I m not roo woried..
fwguyus [19:10]: roo = too
fwguyus [19:10]: i l just have to wait it out...
Andrew [19:11]: Since it's a strong stock in a weak market what you could do is buy a little qid as a hedge against the overall market - just a possibility, but I think it probably would have been better closer to when you first entered S.
fwguyus [19:11]: i l just have to trade small amounts from now..until i m out that trade...
Andrew [19:12]: That's not investment advice or anything - just a trading possibility.
fwguyus [19:12]: yea..thanks.
fwguyus [19:12]: i will buy some more..just to bring down the avg. price..
Andrew [19:13]: That might be good, but I'd probably sell some of the new shares when there's a bounce to protect your downside. Have a pretty tight stop on any new shares you buy.
fwguyus [19:13]: yeap...
fwguyus [19:14]: hey are you a full time trader?
fwguyus [19:14]: i really would like to be and need to be...but
Andrew [19:14]: Not really. I've kind of been practicing full time for the last couple of months though.
fwguyus [19:14]: dont really have the confidence yet...and need some training...any suggestions..
fwguyus [19:15]: what up rw
Andrew [19:15]: A lot of it is figuring out your own individual strengths and weaknesses and then figuring out what style is best suited to them.
fwguyus [19:16]: yea...
Andrew [19:16]: The market will make you pay a lot for any weaknesses so you need to come up with a plan in advance to defend against them.
fwguyus [19:17]: yea..my plan is to wait it out...until they decide the only way i m goint sell my shares is for a profit...
Andrew [19:17]: You seem very good with chart setups, so I'd probably concentrate on risk management, evaluating risk-reward on your entries, and trade management once you are already in a position.
fwguyus [19:17]: yea..risk management is my worst ability..
rw [19:19]: fwguyus
fwguyus [19:19]: i wish there was way quicky allow other users of stockvision to see what you see...
fwguyus [19:20]: like a chart on my desktop..
rw [19:20]: You need to pre determine, before a trade your profit and your potential loss.
Andrew [19:20]: In terms of entries, scaling in might be good for your style - e.g. plan to buy just 1/3rd when it's looking strong, plan to buy another 1/3rd on a pullback when it looks to be bouncing off support, and then only buy the last 1/3rd once the trade is profitable and you get a little confirmation.
rw [19:21]: I will see you all later.........
Andrew [19:21]: Swing trading isn't my specialty though.
fwguyus [19:22]: does any one have checklist to predetermine
fwguyus [19:22]: bye rw
Andrew [19:22]: Then worst case scenario, you only lose 2/3rds of what you would have lost otherwise. And if a stock really gets hammered down and then has a high volume reversal you have flexibility to buy the other 1/3rd much lower. Then you have the flexibility to lighten up a bit when the trade goes back to flat, and then you can add back once you get more confirmation.
Andrew [19:23]: What sort of checklist are you thinking of?
fwguyus [19:24]: to ummm...basically predetirmine a trade
Andrew [19:24]: I think the main thing is to FIRST look at how much you could lose for any potential trade and only then look at how high it could go if that amount of loss is acceptable.
fwguyus [19:25]: and know exatly what you are wanting to do before a trade is placed...
Andrew [19:25]: It might be helpful before you enter to actually write out your trading plan and set a hard stop loss at a predetermined point (for at least half your position).
fwguyus [19:27]: i once heard a guy talking about, that the only successful trades in the long term are the ones who know exatcly what they want out of every trade they place...and not changing the trade once its placed..
Andrew [19:28]: I think it depends on the individual. Sometimes with swing trades you can tweak the trade a bit to your favor, but the core of your decisionmaking should be how it was before your entry (i.e. eliminates any emotional attachment you might have developed while in it).
fwguyus [19:29]: exactly...
fwguyus [19:29]: there shouldnt be any emotion in the trade...except for the emotion you were planning for...
Andrew [19:29]: S is tough to trade because it's tough to make much without risking a lot due to its recent volatility.
Andrew [19:32]: In terms of your 19:27 comment I think it's most important to know exactly where you will get out of a losing trade. But I don't think it is as important to know exactly where you want to take profits in a winning trade. If that makes sense.
fwguyus [19:33]: yea..but for me most of the time a winning trade turns into a losing trade...
fwguyus [19:33]: so knowing how much profit you want and how much lost u can bare.. seems much moe desirealble to me...
fwguyus [19:34]: that way you dont expect too much and can control your loss...
fwguyus [19:34]: because being in a losing trade for a long time can be emotionally draining..
Andrew [19:34]: Sometimes good trades wind up being losers because they turn back against you, but that isn't necessarily too bad if you were following your plan. You can also go broke taking profits that are too small.
fwguyus [19:34]: lol
fwguyus [19:35]: its funny how s made up to 4.63 now..we may see a gap up on it tomm..
Andrew [19:36]: Maybe then figuring out a place to sell 1/2 or 2/3rds of your position can good, and then set a trailing stop for the rest of it. Eventually you will find one that will keep on running in your favor and it can help make up for a lot of losing trades if you keep your losing trades small enough.
Andrew [19:37]: Yeah, the emotionally draining aspect is one reason I prefer day trading.
Andrew [19:38]: I was freaking out earlier about being down just over 2% in a position and I kind of messed up a bit.
Andrew [19:38]: But if I had been swing trading the equivalent probably would have been down 10% or so. Big difference.
Andrew [19:38]: With day trading you can keep the size of your losing trades a lot smaller.
Andrew [19:39]: And then maybe 1-2 times a month you can actually catch a 10%-20% winning trade and it can make up for a ton of losers.
rw [19:54]: test
rw [19:55]: What Andrew is saying is very important ---if you manage the money - then come up with a system or a set up that you use all the time - with predefined profit and loss you will make money......No reason to get upset. LEts say your system wins 12 of 20 times - You are dong great - if you adjere to money management
rw [19:56]: Andrew wrote some of the most important "rules" that we should follow - all should follow them
rw [19:56]: cut your losers let your winners run......but do predetermine the depth of your loss and the minimum of your gain the take the emotion out if you work your set up like you should
rw [19:57]: What I have learned I have learned from GAR........and others here.
fwguyus [19:57]: very true rw
rw [19:57]: Also re-read Mr. Nesters book
rw [19:59]: I am now using 8 charts they are 7 1/2 by 7........I have moving averages on them and volume the ma are 5 10 and 20, Most times I buy when the five and ten cross the 20 and sell when the 5 goes back thru the 10. Practice with this even on FAZ it works well - I am ridding myself of all the others cci macd adx bol etc.......
rw [20:01]: using 5 minute charts for one day
Andrew [20:01]: Moving avg. crossover methods work well in trending markets but not too well in sideways markets unless you are only looking for quick profits.
Andrew [20:01]: Bye
rw [20:03]: ANDREW: Your comments are greatly appreciated.....I had not thought of that....
rw [20:03]: as I said I do not chew gum and walk any more.... LOL LOL
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